2002 Toyota Tundra SR5 from North America - All Comments

8:58 being far from rich as you say, it's unlikely you have owned or had much experience with many high end domestics lately.

The commenter likely has not owned well equipped luxury domestics/imports acquired new to base first hand comments upon.

Also some commenters such as myself have had mixed ownership for years, and buy quite a number of vehicles.

You may not like the negativity on the imports, especially Hondas, I have seen drop dramatically the past several years, but do your own research.

The VW bug is yet another vehicle that is not the quality of old ones; I had 4 of them, the best being a 1974. Probably still running today. I highly doubt the latest ones will hold up mechanically over time.

The comments seem to bear this out; mechanically they have dropped. My last bug was indestructible. Still, if you bought the bug late 60's $1999 or bought a 74 new at $2400, you had a great car then.

I see newer imports weaker today as far as quality including Mercedes. On the other hand I am not in the shop anymore, since switching to domestics entirely. I buy V8 high end vehicles that run effortlessly and are fun and comfortable. No weak warranties as well.

"This country as a whole loves to tell the rest of the world how we are the only superpower and how much better we are than everyone else."

We are talking about cars here, not politics. If you have problems with our/your country's policies, voice your concerns to your elected officials. Do not go bashing your country on an international forum.

You should also know that the government's positions (which I am not implying you accurately characterized) do not necessarily correspond with the views of the American people. You disagree with them...or at least your own interpretation of them. This country gives you the freedom to do so, if you happen to still appreciate that. Do not paint with such a broad brush.

07:35 'Tacoma' guy here. Once again, you misunderstand. First and foremost, I don't rue the day I bought my Tacoma, nor any of my Toyota's. I DO regret ever buying a Ford, Chevy, or Dodge, and have owned at least one of each.

Here's the deal: despite what you think, or what I can convince you of or can't, Toyota does make a better product. I don't care if you agree, I don't care if you believe it. I know it, proven through repeated ownership of each, just as millions of other people have discovered this fact in switching from domestics to imports. Believe what you like, it makes no difference to me.

What I will NOT do, is subject myself and my wallet to the ownership of another Ford or Chevy, just because YOU think if I don't buy one, the economy will collapse. I notice you fail to mention that your precious Big 3 are making more and more vehicles overseas, and selling out American jobs.

Toyota is what it is. A high quality, clearly foreign company. They are BRINGING jobs here, while the Big 3 are moving them overseas.

Yes, I know the percentages of how many Americans they employ vs. how many Toyota employs TODAY. The thing to pay attention to is the trend. It's moving in the direction I described. GM is closing plants here and moving what's left to overseas labor, a little at a time. Dodge wasn't even owned by an American company for a while, and who knows when they'll sell out next.

I've said this before: Look at all of your appliances, radios, toasters, tv's, the computer you're reading this on, etc. More than likely EVERY piece of it, or nearly every piece is made overseas somewhere. You bought it. It's a foreign product and YOUR money went to a company owned by people who are NOT Americans. Do you feel bad about this? I'd be interested to hear your answer.

The point is, I will not allow you to condemn me or anyone else for having the brains to buy a better product even though it isn't made in the states. And the fact is, many Toyota's have more American parts content than many GM's and Ford's. I buy them because they're a better product, and the better product will ALWAYS get my money whether it's made in American, Japan, Sweden, Germany; I don't care where.

As I said earlier, I won't be scared into buying a substandard car (GM, Ford) by the threat of the automobile industry weakening.

By the way, the automobile industry does not constitute the entire U.S. economy; only a minute percentage of it. So... anyone at GM/Ford reading here??... I'm an American looking to buy the best product I can... show me something. Show me you can do better than Toyota. You haven't yet, so I will continue to buy accordingly.

Thank you 07:35. I made comment 11:29, and it is good to see that there are others who are concerned about the future of our country.

Like you, I have owned numerous domestic cars, trucks and SUV's from all 3 of the domestic manufacturers. My first was a 1949 Ford with 100,000 miles on it, up to my current 2007 Ford. I have never had an engine or transmission failure in ANY of my many cars (I'm an older guy), not even the '49 Ford. All of my domestic cars have been sold or traded in good running condition.

My family has put over 200,000 miles on several cars over the years, and over 300,000 on one Ford. We did venture into import territory in the 80's and 90's, but all three of the imports were not very reliable, and two never even made it to 100,000 miles.

11:18 Yes it is a great time to pick up used vehicles with higher fuel consumption in 2008. My theory worked before, and many regretted switching to such plain, boring cars in the past just over fuel.

A lot of people in my opinion with families, activities etc bought larger vehicles because in fact they needed the practicality. I read in some cases factoring in trading in now panicking and taking a loss, the higher insurance, new more payments,debt, higher new car insurance in many cases, even with a high mpg vehicle they may gain a grand perhaps of savings a year in many cases. Why sacrifice room, nice ride and handling and be crammed?

There is some great car buys now used. It's amazing people get the fuel scare, but then won't even remotely consider or ever give up their daily large lattes, multiple same household text phones and MP3's, waxing, nail salons, tanning booths, beauty makeovers, designer jeans and t shirts that have designer writing on them, high caffeine drinks, upon bottles of bottled water that cost more than fuel, and expensive cigarettes to name a few senseless extravagances. But they will throw in the towel over gas...

My cars are far more fun to drive than a bland uninspired potato vehicle.

A few of the items I mentioned are free, but people will pay dearly for them without batting an eyelash. I'll take a nicely equipped larger V8 before even if I slightly reduce my driving. I cannot see a family of 4 doing much with sports and other activities, cramming in the little compacts, and giving up a non problematic nice existing SUV.

"5th Jul 2008, 08:58.

11:29 I'm an American too, and gladly. I never claimed that I wanted to see American industry of any kind fail. Too bad it already has.

If I'm 'spouting venom' at the Big 3, it's because they don't care enough to make vehicles of the same quality as the imports I've owned. They should be embarrassed as a whole at the kind of cars and trucks they made through the 80's and 90's, which were just an embarrassment next to what Toyota and Honda were and are offering."

I remember when you first started commenting. You keep claiming that all domestic vehicles of the 1980's and 1990's were so terrible, but I seriously doubt that you have driven any of those vehicles. I'll be glad to fill you in on the "terribly unreliable" domestic vehicles from that era that my family owned.

* 1980 Plymouth Volarè station wagon: purchased for $1,200 with 60,000 miles and driven to 180,000 miles before selling it to a family friend who needed a good car.

* 1983 Chevy Cavalier station wagon: purchased for $350 with 100,000 miles and driven to 210,000 miles when it was sold in favor of something with more room.

* 1984 Plymouth Reliant station wagon: purchased for $1,500 with 65,000 miles and driven to 215,000 miles before being sold to an uncle who continued to drive it until he died.

* 1985 Dodge Ramcharger: purchased for $2,500 with 163,000 miles and driven to 260,000 miles when it was sold to somebody who needed a dependable plow truck.

* 1989 Chevy Van: purchased for $5,000 with 75,000 miles and driven to 190,000 miles when it was sold, in perfect running condition, for $4,500

* 1990 Pontiac 6000 station wagon: purchased for $700 with 120,000 miles and driven to 220,000 miles, at which time the transmission locked up.

* 1994 Cadillac Seville: purchased for $1,600 with 150,000 miles and still running perfectly with 200,000 miles on it.

* 1997 Mercury Sable station wagon: purchased for $6,000 with 40,000 miles and still running perfectly with 190,000 miles on it.

Oh yes, those lousy domestic cars of the '80s and '90s are clearly sooo unreliable and expensive to maintain! It's just a wonder that we haven't flocked to the preciously perfect imports! Give me a break! No doubt you'll reply with some reference as to how "Car and Driver" didn't like those cars.

16:55 GM has a reputation for making cheap, crappy cars. Whether or not you admit it, it's still true.

And please don't reply and ask me to 'prove' that statement.

In general, in this country, GM and Ford now have a well-earned, lousy reputation for making disposable cars and trucks. Granted, for whatever reason, their cars are much worse.

Toyota and Honda especially are the gold standard. Please explain to me why they've gotten so many more favorable ratings than the domestics in the last 20 years, or why a Toyota holds a far higher percentage of its resale value through the years. I'd love to hear your explanation of that.

I'll be glad to go ahead and tell you why: they're built better, and have more life left in them as time passes than the disposable domestics do, and are therefore, obviously, worth more money as they get older.

You're only kidding yourself here. Funny how even GM and Ford concede that Toyota quality is above theirs. How you ask? Every piece of crap car they advertise is advertised as a 'serious competitor' to the Camry and Accord. The problem with saying that is, it's never true.

I even heard a Ford commercial that stated, and I quote... "now as reliable as Toyota". Which means, even in Ford's opinion of THEIR OWN CARS, they're admitting that Toyota quality exceeds theirs. Everybody already knows this, and, again, the problem with that commercial is that, yes, Ford self-admittedly wasn't as reliable as any Toyota, and they still aren't.

So, go ahead and write me another list of domestic cars with high mileage. I believe anything I read. If all of that is true, it still means nothing. Those kind of mileages, while an accomplishment for a Ford or Chevy, mean very little to a Toyota owner. We get it practically every time, get better gas mileage doing it, and our cars are worth more every time on trade-in, excluding whatever domestic cars that might be considered classics or collectors.

I agree, in part, with commenter 16:35, who is obviously quite well off (not everyone can afford $4 a gallon gas with a 7 mpg SUV).

We own a mid-sized GM SUV and it would cost way more to "panic trade" for a more economical car than the additional fuel cost for another 150,000 miles. Of course, ours gets 24mpg highway and 19 city, so the increase in fuel mileage of a smaller car wouldn't be all that much.

With that said, we are like all too many people in that our SUV carries only ONE person (my wife) 99.9% of the time. Even if we had 4 passengers, our small compact easily accommodates 4 people comfortably.

When it does come time to trade we WILL buy a 30mpg+ vehicle. High gas prices are here to stay, and the environment is in serious trouble. There is simply no excuse to buy something that just aggravates the situation. Although we, too, can afford $4 a gallon gas, this is our last SUV.

"6th Jul 2008, 11:50.

The point is, I will not allow you to condemn me or anyone else for having the brains to buy a better product even though it isn't made in the states."

At the same time, you should expect to be challenged when making broad-brush statements based on personal bias, referenced only by selective quotations and anecdotes.

The fact that you deliver these statements in an highly opinionated manner that is dismissive of the experience of others does not help you influence anyone, and should be expected to draw criticism.

I, for one, keep meticulous records of every vehicle I have ever owned, and know in detail what my average cost per month, average cost per mile, and maintenance intervals are. I even have the equations that describe the ownership costs for my vehicles. Thus, when you make a statement to the effect that "All Fords are junk" or "All domestics are junk", I have the documented evidence to dispute you. Some of us simply feel compelled to set the record straight when someone attempts to perpetuate this great myth of "unreliable domestics" and "infallible Japanese superiority."

"The point is, I will not allow you to condemn me or anyone else for having the brains to buy a better product even though it isn't made in the states."

I have an IQ that is 20 points higher than MENSA genius level. I think that qualifies me as "having brains". I buy domestics because my past domestics were reliable and my imports weren't. To me, that is a VERY intelligent choice. Even if it could somehow be demonstrated that imports were better, I'd still buy American because I'm knowledgeable enough about economics to know that the destruction of a major American industry would have very drastic consequences for ALL of us, including individuals who base their entire automotive knowledge on one 10-year-old truck.

11:50 brought up the kitchen and household appliance issue somehow comparing a quality comment to Toyota and the seemingly lack of new American products in our household.

If you look closer lately, I am not seeing Japan as much as you think. I am seeing Malaysia and Chinese products.

Here's a great example of planned obsolescence. They break with plastic lightweight parts, gears etc and they are throwaways. Yet here's a great example of domestics still performing. My mother bought 2 domestic vacuums built in North Canton Ohio for each floor, and has used them constantly since the early 80's. She has them lubricated cleaned reasonably at a the local vac shop. I found them well constructed. If you flip them over you have full cast aluminum bases and the top bearings can be easily removed, belt fan replacement is actually a simple do it yourself repair. I noticed this replacing her bulb other than that it's reasonable to drop off at a vac shop.

My wife on the other hand constantly buys new upright vacs that are expensive junk, completely full of plastic, and it's pretty, but they are crap and made overseas. My point is the same with import cars we have owned they have not been reliable.

Plus my young teen son sat on the hood of a new Honda Accord (not jumped), weight about 130, and he put a major dent in the hood. But it's a throwaway society anymore. Look at the steel and the weld quality on an older American made Schwinn bicycle, and then look at a new kids bike made out of scrap steel. Another example.

15:54 No, you don't have any documented evidence to dispute anything I said. Your Fords or Chevy's may have ran for a while, but the build quality still wasn't and isn't as good as a Toyota; not on the day you bought it.

You can have your opinions of course, but anybody can see that any Toyota is better put together than any Ford or GM, parking them side by side.

And to put a finer point on it, Toyota engines are so much better designed and built that there is no comparison.

Ahh... So we're now comparing kitchen appliances.

First of all, just try to find any appliances still made in the USA. None of them are.

Secondly, try and find any new appliances that aren't made out of cheap materials. I have a 6 year old Magic Chef gas oven/range. While it is assembled in the US, all the parts are from Mexico. The eyes constantly burn out the igniters. The igniter module burned out twice, and the front handle comes loose no matter how many times the screws are re-tightened. The gas burners also like to rust to the range top. Absolute garbage.

I'll agree - many things made decades ago were better. But regardless of where it was made, everything has gotten crappier over time because of competition and the desire to cut costs and corners. This is why most US manufacturing is history and why US factories constantly shut their doors. This is especially true with the US auto manufacturing industry.

"8th Jul 2008, 17:48

15:54 No, you don't have any documented evidence to dispute anything I said. Your Fords or Chevy's may have ran for a while, but the build quality still wasn't and isn't as good as a Toyota; not on the day you bought it.

You can have your opinions of course, but anybody can see that any Toyota is better put together than any Ford or GM, parking them side by side.

And to put a finer point on it, Toyota engines are so much better designed and built that there is no comparison."

So, you once again have nothing left but to revert to the same old "It's obvious that Toyota is better because I say so" and deny that anyone could really have owned a dozen high mileage domestic vehicles.

Toyota engines are "so much better designed and built" why, exactly? Because you think your old beater Tacoma is the best truck ever made? People present lists of trouble-free domestic vehicles they have owned, and your response is "Everybody knows that Toyota is better."

Obviously you're not prepared for any serious debate, but revert only to the same position that you hate American cars and industry, and worship Japanese cars, and no facts will dissuade you from those views. You "believe" all domestic cars to be junk, but the facts just don't support that belief. There is a difference between belief and fact. For example, your belief is not supported by the facts.

I don't own a truck, but I read these foreign v. domestic threads, and would like to throw my two cents in.

Toyota has excellent quality mechanically speaking as far as the engine, drivetrain, and A/C components. Other things you could make a case.

My mom has a 1996 Corolla. It has 142,000 miles on it. The engine, transmission and A/C are still it top condition. But currently the CV joints are shot, so it sounds like rollers when you drive it. The engine is loud and louder at highway speeds. You have to talk loud to have a conversation.

The ride is harsh, the front door keyhole has fallen in, which seems to be an extremely common problem for 90's Toyota's (just go to the junkyard). Also the trunk key lock is stuck so you can't open the trunk. But I don't drive it often, but if it got fixed, I wouldn't mind having it because it gets great gas mileage. So all in all, it's a good car, but not without it's share of problems.

Me I have a domestic, a 95, which is about the same age as my mom's Corolla. I've had it for two years, cost me $2800 and it refuses to break down.

Is it perfect, no, but it isn't the crap everyone refers to, plus it's a luxury car.

The only repairs that I've had to do to it that where absolutely necessary was replaced a temp sensor that got brittle and fell out the radiator, complete brake job, and I recently replace the alternator.

I also got a paint job (cheap GM paint) and repaired my A/C, which I could have prevented from going out when it did. I ignored the signs and my compressor seized.

I'm not scared to take it out on the road any day. Recently I did 900 miles in three days, 400 miles in one day alone. It didn't break a sweat. But I'm realistic about things too. I expect the transmission to go out in the 170k-180k range, and I currently have 139,000 miles on it. That's the mileage I see on the cars at the junkyard that are the same line as mine.

In conclusion, I say that people talk worse about domestics than they really are, and at the same token, people don't respect the mechanical quality of imports, which is undeniable.

I say in the end drive what you like. I thought people had choices in what they drive, and they should respect the next man in his choice. You don't have to drive their car everyday, so don't worry about it.