2002 Toyota Tundra SR5 from North America - All Comments

Comment 14:00 reminded me of an incident that occurred with my very first car when I was just 16. The car was a 1949 Ford sedan with the flathead engine. It was as old then as I was!! It had around 125,000 miles on it.

A friend bet me I couldn't get up to 75 mph between one rural mailbox and another. I got up to 80, but there was a very steep hill that dipped down, then back up again. I became airborne and slammed into the opposite hill at 80mph. We measured the tire marks (it was a gravel road) and my Ford had been airborne for over 75 feet before impacting the upward slanting road. It hit so hard it ripped off my right "lake pipe" (you older guys know what those were). Other than that there was not a hint of any damage of any kind.

I drove that car for another 5 years with no trouble. If I had been in an import (even a Tundra) there would have been pieces of it scattered for 50 feet in all directions.

I'm not sure why it seems that all those who obviously hate anything not stamped with an American badge of some sort, are so concerned and eager to tell those who own something that isn't American that they've never known anyone to have a problem with whatever domestic vehicle in question. The fact is that ALL cars and trucks have problems. They are man-made mechanical objects and are all prone to having eventual failures.

This sort of anti-import tone seems to have really picked up in the last few years as Toyota eats away at whatever remaining lead GM might have in terms of sales and volume. The fact is that 50 years ago, the first Toyotas that got shipped to California barely ran in the hot weather. They overheated and could barely accelerate. They were anything but reliable. Had they maintained that line of engineering, they would probably have gone the way of Yugo, Daewoo, and Fiat, which is to say that they would not be sold in the US anymore. But that wasn't the case, they drastically improved their engineering, and made better and better cars that over time gained a reputation of reliability.

The ironic thing about the success of various Japanese automakers is that the brain behind it was actually an American named Edward Demming who introduced the practice of lean manufacturing and close quality control to Japanese companies. GM, Ford, and Chrysler totally ignored these business models and continued chugging out garbage for the masses.

By the time Japanese automakers became a threat to Detroit, irreparable damage was done to the reputation of domestic brands simply because the delta between the quality of Japanese and American brand vehicles was immense. This delta remained pretty wide until the late 90's, at which point domestic brands began to improve. But make no mistake: the loss of market share, perception of quality, and their continues slump year after year was self-inflicted. I think now all domestic brands get it: they MUST produce quality vehicles or fail.

But even to this day, they're still cutting corners: The Chevy Aveo is a cheap and poorly made Daewoo from Korea. A good bit of Ford's products are a mish-mash of stuff using Volvo, Mazda, and Ford platforms. Most of their best-selling products are actually made in Mexico.

Let me put it this way to give some of you some perspective: My family originally owned an Oldsmobile Delta 88, a Buick Electra, and a Chevy Malibu. These were all from the early to mid eighties. The Malibu was OK, but the other two had catastrophic problems such as transmission failure, electrical gremlins, and a blown head gasket. We then owned 2 Camrys, a 4runner, and now my Tacoma. My brother owns an Avalon. We've NEVER had one single problem with any of these cars. When I mean never, I'm dead serious. The cars were flawless. Later, my dad bought a 94' Ford F-250 brand-new off the lot. It ran fine for about 75,000 miles, then one day the water pump went out. It was easy to replace, but within a month, the intake manifold formed a leak. After that, the alternator stopped working. He traded it in on a new Tundra 7 years ago. So far, the Tundra has been flawless after 200,000+ miles.

Now I keep on hearing from people about how much 'better' domestic brands are from just a few years ago. But even so, why should I switch when I've never had a problem with any of the Toyotas I've ever driven or owned? I gain nothing from taking a chance on a product that I suspect is hit or miss even today. You'll find that most of us who have had decades of trouble-free service from our Toyotas and Hondas feel the same. There's your answer.

In regards to keeping money in the US by supporting US branded cars, well as mentioned, most US cars these days are full of Chinese, Mexican, and Brazillian parts. Others are imported entirely. Others are made in Mexico, Canada, and even Germany. Most of the money goes into the pockets of the corporate big-wigs. On the other hand, My truck was made in California with 60% US-made parts, the rest from Japan. My Brother's Avalon was made in Lexington, KY using 50% US parts. My Dad's Tundra was made in Indiana using approximately 60% US parts. All in all, the cars and trucks we own probably use more American labor than any of those so-called domestics.

Lastly, the decline of the US dollar has nothing to do with people buying foreign goods. It is due to the Fed cutting rates, which encourages inflation. If anything, a weak dollar actually encourages US exports.

13:41 Tired argument. You 'domestic' owners don't seem to get it actually. The Ford Fusion is made in Mexico. Many Fords are made overseas. The Chevy Aveo is made in North Korea. That's your idea of an 'American' product? It isn't mine. There is no foreign/domestic anymore. It's all about buying what's best for the money, and that means Toyota, Honda, Nissan, NOT Ford, Chevy, or Dodge. They fell behind decades ago and never caught up.

Since there is not one import truck capable of what my full size domestic can do, where is the superior comparison? I would endanger everyone on the roadways.

If you keep emphasizing the best, how about referring to applications? I certainly cannot tow or carry any equivalent load safely... even the Hyundai and Aveo and Tacoma cannot perform, so why should I buy one.

The rear end, trans and engine would be scattered no doubt on the highway, but I could see someone adding a tow hitch on here. It would save gas right?

I see the opposite engine and transmission woes throughout this site on imports. Toyota/Honda warranty is no where near equal, there is less room, the domestics have better handling ability and load, bed and people carrying ability, and ride better. I see that as superior... not doing less, being in an uncomfortable vehicle, does not handle as well, half or less the warranty, not being able to tow or carry as much.

I have a 3/4 ton... are you saying a half ton is superior as far as capability or function? Maybe I am missing something; buy a lot less, but it's superior?

Has anyone test drove the newest models import/domestic full size trucks besides me. I suspect we will still read about Tacomas, Hyundais and Aveos. Why buy a full size truck? I'd rather read about Ferraris on a full size truck review; at least it's something I find interesting.

"But even so, why should I switch when I've never had a problem with any of the Toyotas I've ever driven or owned? I gain nothing from taking a chance on a product that I suspect is hit or miss even today. You'll find that most of us who have had decades of trouble-free service from our Toyotas and Hondas feel the same. There's your answer."

Funny, I feel exactly the same about my Dodges. Are you willing to accept that I could have had the same experience with my Dodges as you had with your Toyotas? Or are you convinced that only Toyotas can be as great as you say, and domestics are and always have been junk?

If you drive 40,000 miles plus a year with that logic, you at some point have a decision to make.

The last truly reliable import, my mid 90's Legend, would have somewhere around 500,000 miles on it in 2008 if I never sold it. As usual it was purchased as a new vehicle. Although never cheap to buy, they were durable. I have found even with the best Hondas I had, at 100,000 miles a lot of repairs come forth nonetheless. I have gone as high as 150,000 miles, but it involved just about everything needing expensive attention.

I do not see the logic in driving a vehicle forever unless you drive very little. With imports, I would buy a low mileage old import, and in fact did buy my youngest driver a low mile 1999 Honda Civic 5 speed.

I know this is a Toyota full size truck forum, and this has absolutely no relevance. I buy new trucks full size however, and might comment on one that I had new 25 years ago that was great, but what relevance does that have on a late model full size truck review?

I can comment however on test driving new full size import and domestic models, and in fact buy. I will not hold back a relevant recent late model full size truck comment to give my opinion. I found more reasons to own a new GM full size than a Tundra at this point in time. If more benefits, function and practicality arise in the future, I may buy one. But I see limited applications for us to even contemplate, and I did not like the ride or handling. Maybe I am extremely hard to please, but I buy and put a lot of mileage and strain on a full size truck. I tow long distances in intense heat and have had zero issues.

I have lost faith in reliability in imports unless they are older models... and I feel my son is better having a 1999 than a 2008 model. He doesn't want to be out breaking down as my wife frequently did.

"Are you willing to accept that I could have had the same experience with my Dodges as you had with your Toyotas? Or are you convinced that only Toyotas can be as great as you say, and domestics are and always have been junk?"

I'm perfectly willing to accept that you may have never had any problem with your Dodge trucks. I am also happy to accept the fact that somewhere out there, a couple of guys driving Yugos are also very happy that despite the "negative perception" that they've never had any problems with their particular Yugo... just to prove us all wrong.

But that doesn't automatically mean that Yugo, or any other manufacture defy market data that still show that by and large, Toyota and Honda still have an extremely high reliability and quality rating over American automakers. This only reinforces why I have no reason to switch, or reason to believe that a few on this site who claim they've never-ever had a problem with their Dodge/Ford/GM product, come close to representing the average owner of such products.

15:36 No, domestics have not always been junk. They are now, and have been since the mid 70's or so. The top 'imports' took the lead spots in quality decades ago.

Your Dodge; any Dodge, absolutely could not stand up to the years and years of merciless off-road abuse that my Toyota trucks, and every single other one I know of, have taken and are still running. No domestic truck can. Their engines simply can't handle the abuse. Plain and simple.

If you've put your Dodge through the same kind of abuse that I've put my Toyota trucks through, over the same number of miles and years, then you've done work on the engine or transmission, or replaced one of them, when, in the Toyota, I've never had to.

I've owned Chevy, Ford, Dodge, and Toyota trucks; the Toyota trucks are tougher, hold together better, get better gas mileage, break down MUCH less, if ever, and are without a doubt built with a level of workmanship that you will NOT find in anything the Big 3 have ever built or build today.

There is no comparison. Toyota always did and still does make the far superior vehicle when it comes to reliability and good solid craftsmanship, whether it's a car or truck.

I do not off road, but have a 2001 Dodge Dakota that I am driving as a company vehicle, and will break the 200,000 mile before the year is out. A co worker has over 240,000 on his as a company vehicle.

I believe there may be one lone off roader on here over and over. Whether they are driving a new Tundra off road, I do not know what the point is.

My Dakota has the V8 engine, runs flawless and is almost carlike on trips. I can easily carry 4 adults with the 4 door and having a bed and cap is great. I carry heavy equipment like it is not even in the back. I would recommend this vehicle without hesitation, and since it's a company vehicle I am impartial.

I suspect the import commenter owned old vehicles maybe abused that were cheap and did not have them since they were new. My Dakota was not cheap new; in fact I thought the company paid too much at first. The V8 eats gas; it runs $80 a fill up, sometimes every day or every other day, but it's used for business.

We've owned over 30 domestics and 3 imports. NONE of the domestics (from ALL 3 American companies) EVER had an engine or transmission failure. ALL THREE imports did. Sorry, the math there just DOES NOT add up to imports being better.

My former boss is currently still driving a Dodge truck he bought new in 1986. That's TWENTY-TWO YEARS AGO. It still runs great.

My former neighbor traded his 1986 F-150 last year. He bought it new and drove it for 21 years as a building contractor, so it DID get heavy use.

My family's company still uses a Chevy Silverado that my wife's dad bought new for personal use in 1982 and gave to the company when he bought a new F-150. That's a 25-year-old GM truck (officially an antique!!).

I could give MANY more examples. 25-year-old import trucks don't even EXIST!!

It's pretty funny to listen to these domestic truck owners claiming that a Chevy or a Dodge truck is as reliable or even half as good as any Toyota. Yeah right. Some people just can't accept the fact that the Japanese build better automobiles than we do here in the U.S.

Sometimes it hurts to accept the truth, but American auto manufacturers simply don't care enough to design, build, and sell cars and trucks that can match the quality of a Japanese product. Sorry if some people out there don't like that, but it's unfortunately true.

As an American, I don't like it either. I'd LOVE to buy a Ford and say that it was made in the U.S. and that it was a good vehicle. In fact, I did that for a number of years. But, I was proven wrong.

Fords, Chevy's, etc. aren't always built here, and for darn sure aren't a match in quality for a Toyota. Never were.

I, like millions of other Americans, chose to learn the hard way too. I bought Chevy's and Fords, but got tired of them breaking down all the time while I watch people I know who drove Toyota's just KEEP driving and never fix anything. Eventually I wised up, bit the bullet, and bought a Toyota. Best money I ever spent on an automobile, and I can say that for all 3 that I've owned. Never a single repair; I thought I'd just gotten lucky the first time, but the next two proved themselves to be flawless also.

So... you domestic guys are going to have to come up with something more than stories about Toyota's that you've seen broken down, or similar stories about your Dodge that ran for 400,000 miles with no trouble. Sure, it's possible, but if it's true, then it's a fluke and the complete opposite of the norm; which is that a Toyota will run flawlessly for 2 or 300,000 miles, and a domestic will not.

So, if telling those kinds of stories suits you, go ahead and keep telling them. It won't change the facts of the matter any.

21:45 what Toyota Truck do you own? Let's start with maybe just one comparison for openers... Ford F250 3/4 ton Diesel, and indicate the vast superiority of function, capability of the specific Toyota you own vs say this one model.

Saying all Ford, GM, Dodge encompasses a very broad comment. I would like to know what loads and superior towing your Toyota can perform vs. 3/4 -1 Ton plus pickups?

Can your truck carry and town more than a GM Silverado Duramax? How about a Ram?

Saying what is best, is what can do the most and tow, carry loads, not just some little compact truck bouncing around in the woods. Maybe an off road forum is for you.

21:38 You're skirting the issue here. Will a Chevy 3/4 ton truck tow more than my Tacoma? Of course it will; while it lasts. Too bad they're junk and don't last long.

I'm not talking about towing. I'm talking about build quality and reliability. And Toyota takes the prize there every time. If you need a half ton truck or anything smaller, Toyota builds the best ones by far. If you need something bigger, then I suppose you'll have to buy something else, because Toyota doesn't make them. If they did, they'd no doubt be better trucks than any Ford or Chevy of the same size, just like everything they now make already is.

"21:45 what Toyota Truck do you own? Let's start with maybe just one comparison for openers... Ford F250 3/4 ton Diesel, and indicate the vast superiority of function, capability of the specific Toyota you own vs say this one model."

I tell you what. You got out and buy one of those F250, F350 dually with a massive V8 engine and then tell us how superior you feel dumping $150 a fill up into the tank. I might very well be bouncing along in my small, 30MPG pickup, but you might very well not be driving period because it doesn't take long to make a person go broke these days keeping one of those "fully capable" pickup trucks running and full of gas. Trucks like those are going to be totally obsolete. Ford just announced today the delay of the new F150. This is the face of the future my friends.

"So, if telling those kinds of stories suits you, go ahead and keep telling them. It won't change the facts of the matter any."

Here is a fact: Toyota engines are failing on a widespread basis at low mileages (e.g., under 50,000). Take a look at all the complaints on Consumer Affairs:

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/automotive/toyota_engine.html

I drive domestics and/so have never had an engine fail or give me any serious trouble in my life. Like it or not, that is a fact. You unilaterally dismiss domestic owners' sharing of their positive experiences as a "stories" from your high horse, yet why should anybody believe a word you say? With all of Toyota's recent quality problems, the Consumer Affairs statistics being just one example, the actual facts of the matter do not bolster your opinion.