2002 Toyota Tundra SR5 from North America - Off Topic Comments

Well, of the Big 3, with GM and Chrysler out of business, that should reduce the number of comments made on Toyota sites by about 2/3 according to my math.

Keep telling me how good the crappy new Silverado is after they aren't even in business anymore. I believe I'll stick with Toyota. Even if you don't like them, at least they'll be in business next week.

If GM goes out of business (HIGHLY unlikely) you import fans most likely won't be buying ANYTHING. If the U.S. auto industry goes under, so does the ENTIRE ECONOMY. It will result in a depression greater than that of 1929, and a total collapse of the entire job structure of this country. If you don't have a job, you won't have money to buy anything.

Sadly, people have been so duped by the Japanese auto industry that they honestly think destroying our country is OK. Sorry, I don't agree. I'll buy domestics. They're more reliable anyway, and have much better warranties, which will be honored regardless.

20:56 There have been literally millions of full size trucks sold and it is unlikely that the applications for them will ever vanish. There are many nice examples everywhere again full size to buy.

Since you have never owned one, and will continue to own "Toyota" meaning Tacoma small trucks, how this will have any consequential effect or bearing is unlikely. There are also zero Honda full size trucks and the Tacoma is certainly not full size.

I see a lot of full size trucks (few F-350), but still literally hundreds on busy weekends at our boat ramps. They are full size domestics, full size SUV's including Hummer H1's-H2's, even a nice Lincoln Blackwood that drive similar long distances regularly. I have yet to see a single Tacoma, never a Ridgeline and very few Tundras ever.

The imports I have seen are Mercedes, Porsche etc. usually that have called ahead to pull their boats off the high and dry racks or have permanent slips.

So out of literally hundreds of boats, they are not rolling in Tacomas and Ridgelines, Honda's only small pick up.

I suspect if there ever were a shortage of new domestic full size trucks, one can buy a second low mileage one and spread the wear and mileage over 2 trucks. At any rate, full size truck applications are not going to disappear, and recommending the only small truck Honda has or the Tacoma or even the limited Tundra is not applicable.

Again maybe say "Tacoma" instead of "Toyota" to clarify your full size truck analogy to clarify to those that do not know you do not have the topic indicated on the review heading.

11:53 Very funny. Like I said, the humor does me good. Lots of good stuff in there.

GM going out of business is highly unlikely?? Have you watched the news in the last 6 months? It's very likely. And we import fans will still be buying cars. With a Toyota badge on them, as always, because they are more reliable, because they're built with higher standards. You go ahead and back a dead horse if you like.

Simply put, if you really think "GM may go under", you are drinking your bath water, dead horse? What nerve?! I have owned 5 Toyotas and 2 Nissans, of course they are built better, but those back country boys need their Silverados and F150s, let them buy them and quit griping about who is better, no GM, no US economy.

Should Japan and South Korea really dominate our country? Should our police cars be Avalons, Azeras, Sonatas, and Camrys? Do you understand the concepts of thinking strategically, competitive advantage, and market share?

"I suspect if there ever were a shortage of new domestic full size trucks, one can buy a second low mileage one and spread the wear and mileage over 2 trucks. At any rate, full size truck applications are not going to disappear, and recommending the only small truck Honda has or the Tacoma or even the limited Tundra is not applicable."

Good point. Our two family companies routinely get a quarter of a million miles out of our full sized Ford, Chevy and Dodge trucks and vans. Our Rangers (used for light duty and getting to job sites) often go 300,000 miles. None of these FACTS seem to have any effect on the OPINION of our import fan who has never owned ANY new domestic or ANY full sized truck. If you haven't eaten spinach you can't tell me how awful it is!!

As for the silly argument that GM is "going out of business", NO it ISN'T. Bankruptcy does NOT mean out of business. It means SUPERVISED restructuring, which is something ALL of our companies and financial institutions NEED DESPERATELY. ANY company that is losing billions and gives their former CEO $20,000,000 in severance pay DESERVES to be RIGIDLY supervised. It's no wonder MANY companies are in trouble now. But be that as it may, GM will stay in business and their warranties WILL be honored, though no one ever has to use them anyway. We've never had a warranty repair done on any of our GM, Chrysler or Ford vehicles in the last 20 years. They haven't broken down.

I went and looked at new Fords, GMCs, Cadillacs, and Toyotas the other day.

By FAR the Fords had the best build quality and materials. BY FAR. Soft touch surfaces, rich leather accents, NOT ONE THING felt flimsy on any of the Taurus, Flex, Edge, F150s, or Expeditions I looked at. Granted they were all top level trim, but I also compared the top level trims of the others. The doors all shut very solidly, and overall each vehicle had a high quality feel to them.

The GMC was right behind, but the interior materials of the Sierra were worse than the Ford's and still better than the Toyota Tundra. For example, the Ford F150 Platinum had leather arm rests, center console, and dashboard, with brushed aluminum accents. All nicely trimmed and solid. The GMC and Toyota either had rubberized surfaces or hard "tinny" sounding plastic to the touch. No comparison in fit and finish. The fake plasticky wood trim on the Sequoia and Tundra creaked and was poorly aligned, and the plastics were all of horrible quality. The cars were the same way.

The GMC had good build quality, but still the materials were a little lacking. That I can live with. Total cheapness, I cannot.

After driving the F150, Tundra, and Sierra, the Ford drove 100x better than any. Smooth, very quiet, and solid feeling. The Tundra was NONE of these. There was even a rattle in the back.

The Cadillacs are definitely world-class vehicles. The quality and solid feel of them are downright amazing, next to only a BMW or Audi, Porsche, etc.

Nissans now are also a plethora of hard seas of plastics and cheap feeling interiors, especially the Titan and new Maxima.

The dealership experiences were pretty mixed. The Toyota dealership was very bad, pushy salesman, trying to coax me into certain deals, kept trying to steer me away to other vehicles, telling me I should only look at a Toyota because that's all I should have to look for in a quality vehicle, etc. Ford dealership was next, still somewhat pushy, but understood that when I said I was JUST LOOKING, I meant it. The salesman did a good job of explaining features, and generally was fairly low key. The GMC experience was very good. The salesman dressed nicely, was not pushy at all, took the time to explain the features, never once tried to make a deal or offer on a truck that I didn't want, was very respectful and even shook my 12 year old son's hand and offered him something to drink. Kudos right there.

Domestic quality has gone way up, while non-Domestic quality has dropped quite severely. From walking around the lot on the Toyota dealership, I'll NEVER buy one now. I won't tolerate the bad build quality and very cheap feeling of them all when there's worlds better out there.

My next truck will be a Ford F150.

Oh, and I currently drive a Nissan Hardbody SE pickup. Great little truck, but the new quality of the Imports has steered me away completely.

11:26 Again, very funny. Supervised restructured means supervised restructuring. BANKRUPTCY means out of money, or at least not enough to operate; hence, not enough to do business and OUT OF BUSINESS.

The U.S. government may choose to GIVE them enough money to be BACK in business, like they made the mistake of doing once already, which produced nothing positive. If YOU own a business and are bankrupt, it means the your store closes down. Period.

I've owned GM vehicles before. They're junk, so I stopped buying them. Just like hundreds of thousands of other buyers. I bought something good instead: a Toyota. Which is why Toyota is doing just fine and GM is nearly out of business. Too bad they don't build better automobiles. If they did, they wouldn't be begging for money to stay alive.

But they're still good, right? Yeah, sure. That's the perfect environment for their workers to produce quality cars... Buy a Toyota and see what a good vehicle is like.

There's millions of great full sizes. You have a small import Tacoma and have never owned any. Why fret, your truck isn't the topic or applicable to the review anyway.

21:54 owned a used GM Buick Century. Is that the comparison to condemnation of all brand new GM full size trucks and absolutely all 2009 GM cars? Please clarify as I am wondering what logic applies to every single model available from a 15 year ago used purchase. Actually being quite specific of course. And if I read the prior post, it was not a bad car, even though it was purchased used.

If you wish to condemn an entire manufacturer and expect anyone to buy a Toyota, please be specific on why your vehicle is the best full size available.

I have owned "Toyota" as well and I will read your recommendation and test any full size truck import and domestic. What full size GM model truck have you ever owned past or present, and what current full size do you currently own? Are you implying anyone buying any new full size trucks will have no where to have them serviced?

The number one reason anyone will buy a new full size today (and I know you do not own any full sizes now or in the past) is actual applications.

Service is available everywhere. Not being constricted by price only I can literally buy any full size truck available. I have very careful to buy the best application full size truck, and I find more credibility from the business owner having fleets of full sizes.

I could own a now available as used only H1 if I wished and I have looked at new Escalades, Avalanches - do not like the high sides.

Who says you have to go to a dealer? My warranty mileage goes quick if it's less than 100,000 as a Toyota and too small. I guess I could park it from non use/too small application wise anyway. That makes a lot of sense - buy a Toyota that cannot be used... maybe some can with a Tundra, and again is that the full size you recommend enough to own one?

Irregardless of political issues, how do you ever expect to convert a full size truck owner with specific needs and applications to the Tacoma you have?

"You still have not proven that Japanese cars are more reliable than domestics in any of your diatribes.'

This ONE anti-American import fanatic has already helped sell AT LEAST two Fords (and probably a lot more I don't know about). When such baseless comments are made over and over in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary, it has just the OPPOSITE effect. It makes people laugh first, and then go investigate for themselves. I've used JUST THIS THREAD alone to convince two of my formerly import-owning friends to buy Fords, and emailed this site to dozens of my car enthusiast buddies who regard "Tacoma Guy" as the epitome of the irrational import fan: A Ford has a bad cigarette lighter at 200,000 miles, it is "crap". A Tacoma BREAKS IN HALF at 50,000 miles and it is "superior". That stuff sells a LOT of Fords!!

"BANKRUPTCY means out of money, or at least not enough to operate; hence, not enough to do business and OUT OF BUSINESS."

BLATANTLY FALSE. Auto parts maker Delphi filed bankruptcy in 2005 (FOUR YEARS AGO) due to competition from much more cheaply built parts from Japan and China, and has been carrying on with business as usual ever since. Bankruptcy is designed to SAVE businesses, NOT put them out of business. A business operating under Chapter 11 bankruptcy HAS to maintain sound business practices and operate under stringent regulations (which ALL businesses should be forced to do anyway). If GM files bankruptcy it will HAVE to stay in business to meet requirements of the bankruptcy filing, just as Delphi has stayed in business. NO difference AT ALL to customers, except better cars, better service and a legally mandated warranty.

As has been pointed out, this entire tirade against American business is helping to sell a lot of domestics, and we need that right now.

"I've used JUST THIS THREAD alone to convince two of my formerly import-owning friends to buy Fords"

I like Fords too, but someone who would buy a $25,000-$50,000 vehicle on the say-so of some nameless, faceless bloggers on a Tundra thread, no less, is a gambler of Russian proportions.

No one on here can even prove that they have a drivers license, let alone prove that they own the vehicles they claim to. In fact some of the claims made here on this site are of such an improbable nature that it's doubtful that they do.

This site is especially useful when you read detailed information given as the miles are racked up. They can really shed light on the TYPES of problems an owner may encounter with certain vehicles.

But to treat the blogs as some kind of conclusive evidence while ignoring reliability surveys suggests that somebody doesn't know either the nature of blogs or of reliability surveys. For all they know, half the bloggers on here are employed by a manufacturer.

I like Ford F150, Chevy Silverado, and 08-09 Toyota Tundra (if they continue to maintain the average+ reliability scores -- I'm a little unsure with the Toyota because of the nature of the early problems in the 07s). Dodge has a new model so I'm not sure about them... looks good, though. This is based on multi-sourced RESEARCH... not anecdotal commentary by strangers on a blog who can't even prove that they have EVER owned a full-sized truck of ANY kind.

After that it comes down to test drives, capacities, and applications. Depending on your needs, you may have quite a few good choices. If you're just towing a fishing boat, for example, you've got dozens.

But to treat a blog as anything more than blind jousting... that just honestly amazes me.

20:17 Glad I could help you sell two Fords. Please convince as many people as you can to buy more Fords. That way, those of us who actually do out research when we buy, and want something better, such as a Toyota, can pay a little less for it if people are buying junk from the "competition". Fords also keep the economy going a little more. It keeps jobs for people who work in parts stores and garages all over the country. So.. please keep buying those Fords and Chevy's; if they manage to stay in business, Toyota quality will be my little secret.

20:17 Your comment would be much more interesting if it contained a single, solitary fact. More likely, at 200,000 miles, if by some miracle, a Ford is still running and HASN'T had a second or third engine and transmission replaced, the ONLY thing the might still be working would be the cigarette lighter.

In reality, Toyota's are most likely running just fine at 200,000 miles while the Ford rusts in a junkyard. There's a reason they're worth nothing at that mileage and a Honda or Toyota IS: the import is built well enough and still has the potential for many more miles and the Ford doesn't. Hence... worth nothing or close to it.

I always got a kick out of people in anything but Toyota's that would try to follow my buddy's '91 Toyota truck off road. It most likely had two or three times as many miles on it and left the S-10's and Rangers either stuck or broken down overheating... good times. It was sold still running at or around 300,000 miles. We don't know, because, I will admit... the odometer stopped working at around 225,000 or so. That didn't seem to faze the engine that just kept running under abuse for another 100,000 or so after that. Try that with a Ford... yeah, right.