2002 Toyota Tundra SR5 from North America - Off Topic Comments

If you drive 40,000 miles plus a year with that logic, you at some point have a decision to make.

The last truly reliable import, my mid 90's Legend, would have somewhere around 500,000 miles on it in 2008 if I never sold it. As usual it was purchased as a new vehicle. Although never cheap to buy, they were durable. I have found even with the best Hondas I had, at 100,000 miles a lot of repairs come forth nonetheless. I have gone as high as 150,000 miles, but it involved just about everything needing expensive attention.

I do not see the logic in driving a vehicle forever unless you drive very little. With imports, I would buy a low mileage old import, and in fact did buy my youngest driver a low mile 1999 Honda Civic 5 speed.

I know this is a Toyota full size truck forum, and this has absolutely no relevance. I buy new trucks full size however, and might comment on one that I had new 25 years ago that was great, but what relevance does that have on a late model full size truck review?

I can comment however on test driving new full size import and domestic models, and in fact buy. I will not hold back a relevant recent late model full size truck comment to give my opinion. I found more reasons to own a new GM full size than a Tundra at this point in time. If more benefits, function and practicality arise in the future, I may buy one. But I see limited applications for us to even contemplate, and I did not like the ride or handling. Maybe I am extremely hard to please, but I buy and put a lot of mileage and strain on a full size truck. I tow long distances in intense heat and have had zero issues.

I have lost faith in reliability in imports unless they are older models... and I feel my son is better having a 1999 than a 2008 model. He doesn't want to be out breaking down as my wife frequently did.

"Are you willing to accept that I could have had the same experience with my Dodges as you had with your Toyotas? Or are you convinced that only Toyotas can be as great as you say, and domestics are and always have been junk?"

I'm perfectly willing to accept that you may have never had any problem with your Dodge trucks. I am also happy to accept the fact that somewhere out there, a couple of guys driving Yugos are also very happy that despite the "negative perception" that they've never had any problems with their particular Yugo... just to prove us all wrong.

But that doesn't automatically mean that Yugo, or any other manufacture defy market data that still show that by and large, Toyota and Honda still have an extremely high reliability and quality rating over American automakers. This only reinforces why I have no reason to switch, or reason to believe that a few on this site who claim they've never-ever had a problem with their Dodge/Ford/GM product, come close to representing the average owner of such products.

15:36 No, domestics have not always been junk. They are now, and have been since the mid 70's or so. The top 'imports' took the lead spots in quality decades ago.

Your Dodge; any Dodge, absolutely could not stand up to the years and years of merciless off-road abuse that my Toyota trucks, and every single other one I know of, have taken and are still running. No domestic truck can. Their engines simply can't handle the abuse. Plain and simple.

If you've put your Dodge through the same kind of abuse that I've put my Toyota trucks through, over the same number of miles and years, then you've done work on the engine or transmission, or replaced one of them, when, in the Toyota, I've never had to.

I've owned Chevy, Ford, Dodge, and Toyota trucks; the Toyota trucks are tougher, hold together better, get better gas mileage, break down MUCH less, if ever, and are without a doubt built with a level of workmanship that you will NOT find in anything the Big 3 have ever built or build today.

There is no comparison. Toyota always did and still does make the far superior vehicle when it comes to reliability and good solid craftsmanship, whether it's a car or truck.

I do not off road, but have a 2001 Dodge Dakota that I am driving as a company vehicle, and will break the 200,000 mile before the year is out. A co worker has over 240,000 on his as a company vehicle.

I believe there may be one lone off roader on here over and over. Whether they are driving a new Tundra off road, I do not know what the point is.

My Dakota has the V8 engine, runs flawless and is almost carlike on trips. I can easily carry 4 adults with the 4 door and having a bed and cap is great. I carry heavy equipment like it is not even in the back. I would recommend this vehicle without hesitation, and since it's a company vehicle I am impartial.

I suspect the import commenter owned old vehicles maybe abused that were cheap and did not have them since they were new. My Dakota was not cheap new; in fact I thought the company paid too much at first. The V8 eats gas; it runs $80 a fill up, sometimes every day or every other day, but it's used for business.

We've owned over 30 domestics and 3 imports. NONE of the domestics (from ALL 3 American companies) EVER had an engine or transmission failure. ALL THREE imports did. Sorry, the math there just DOES NOT add up to imports being better.

My former boss is currently still driving a Dodge truck he bought new in 1986. That's TWENTY-TWO YEARS AGO. It still runs great.

My former neighbor traded his 1986 F-150 last year. He bought it new and drove it for 21 years as a building contractor, so it DID get heavy use.

My family's company still uses a Chevy Silverado that my wife's dad bought new for personal use in 1982 and gave to the company when he bought a new F-150. That's a 25-year-old GM truck (officially an antique!!).

I could give MANY more examples. 25-year-old import trucks don't even EXIST!!

It's pretty funny to listen to these domestic truck owners claiming that a Chevy or a Dodge truck is as reliable or even half as good as any Toyota. Yeah right. Some people just can't accept the fact that the Japanese build better automobiles than we do here in the U.S.

Sometimes it hurts to accept the truth, but American auto manufacturers simply don't care enough to design, build, and sell cars and trucks that can match the quality of a Japanese product. Sorry if some people out there don't like that, but it's unfortunately true.

As an American, I don't like it either. I'd LOVE to buy a Ford and say that it was made in the U.S. and that it was a good vehicle. In fact, I did that for a number of years. But, I was proven wrong.

Fords, Chevy's, etc. aren't always built here, and for darn sure aren't a match in quality for a Toyota. Never were.

I, like millions of other Americans, chose to learn the hard way too. I bought Chevy's and Fords, but got tired of them breaking down all the time while I watch people I know who drove Toyota's just KEEP driving and never fix anything. Eventually I wised up, bit the bullet, and bought a Toyota. Best money I ever spent on an automobile, and I can say that for all 3 that I've owned. Never a single repair; I thought I'd just gotten lucky the first time, but the next two proved themselves to be flawless also.

So... you domestic guys are going to have to come up with something more than stories about Toyota's that you've seen broken down, or similar stories about your Dodge that ran for 400,000 miles with no trouble. Sure, it's possible, but if it's true, then it's a fluke and the complete opposite of the norm; which is that a Toyota will run flawlessly for 2 or 300,000 miles, and a domestic will not.

So, if telling those kinds of stories suits you, go ahead and keep telling them. It won't change the facts of the matter any.

21:45 what Toyota Truck do you own? Let's start with maybe just one comparison for openers... Ford F250 3/4 ton Diesel, and indicate the vast superiority of function, capability of the specific Toyota you own vs say this one model.

Saying all Ford, GM, Dodge encompasses a very broad comment. I would like to know what loads and superior towing your Toyota can perform vs. 3/4 -1 Ton plus pickups?

Can your truck carry and town more than a GM Silverado Duramax? How about a Ram?

Saying what is best, is what can do the most and tow, carry loads, not just some little compact truck bouncing around in the woods. Maybe an off road forum is for you.

21:38 You're skirting the issue here. Will a Chevy 3/4 ton truck tow more than my Tacoma? Of course it will; while it lasts. Too bad they're junk and don't last long.

I'm not talking about towing. I'm talking about build quality and reliability. And Toyota takes the prize there every time. If you need a half ton truck or anything smaller, Toyota builds the best ones by far. If you need something bigger, then I suppose you'll have to buy something else, because Toyota doesn't make them. If they did, they'd no doubt be better trucks than any Ford or Chevy of the same size, just like everything they now make already is.

"21:45 what Toyota Truck do you own? Let's start with maybe just one comparison for openers... Ford F250 3/4 ton Diesel, and indicate the vast superiority of function, capability of the specific Toyota you own vs say this one model."

I tell you what. You got out and buy one of those F250, F350 dually with a massive V8 engine and then tell us how superior you feel dumping $150 a fill up into the tank. I might very well be bouncing along in my small, 30MPG pickup, but you might very well not be driving period because it doesn't take long to make a person go broke these days keeping one of those "fully capable" pickup trucks running and full of gas. Trucks like those are going to be totally obsolete. Ford just announced today the delay of the new F150. This is the face of the future my friends.

"So, if telling those kinds of stories suits you, go ahead and keep telling them. It won't change the facts of the matter any."

Here is a fact: Toyota engines are failing on a widespread basis at low mileages (e.g., under 50,000). Take a look at all the complaints on Consumer Affairs:

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/automotive/toyota_engine.html

I drive domestics and/so have never had an engine fail or give me any serious trouble in my life. Like it or not, that is a fact. You unilaterally dismiss domestic owners' sharing of their positive experiences as a "stories" from your high horse, yet why should anybody believe a word you say? With all of Toyota's recent quality problems, the Consumer Affairs statistics being just one example, the actual facts of the matter do not bolster your opinion.

22:54 Still, you offer nothing. YOUR opinion of 'widespread' is nothing more than opinion. If you REALLY want to see widespread problems, look up Ford recalls, since they've had WAY more of them in the last 10 years than Toyota. And, just so you understand the difference, that IS an actual fact and not just my opinion.

Yeah, you can find complaints about Toyota's. Show me ANY product regardless of what it is and I will find you a bunch of people complaining about it somewhere online or otherwise. Some clown will complain about his 1990 Toyota truck blowing up at 345,000 miles because he neglected to ever change the timing belt/chain.

My question was not answered from the Toyota owner. Also do not have 6 wheels on my vehicle, does not cost $150 to fill, and diesel is more efficient than the gas V8. At some point how are you going to tow or carry equivalent loads in teeny trucks? Drive a 30-50 mpg car and then have a fully functional full size truck that is at least capable.

"If you need a half ton truck or anything smaller, Toyota builds the best ones by far."

Are you referring to the Tacomas that Toyota is buying back because their frames are falling apart?

I agree about having an economical car, supplemented by a truck to do work with.

I have had an economical car for years that serves as my daily driver, but also a full size heavy duty Dodge truck for hauling the boat, cleaning the yard, etc.

I put 15,000+ miles a year on the car, but less than a thousand miles a year on the truck. But, the truck is a life saver when I need it. A Toyota would not even be a consideration, because I want something that will hold up and can do real work.

I started out with compact pickups years ago, as did a friend of mine who owned a VW Diesel pickup. Sure it was good on fuel, but actually very impractical to own. It got even higher mileage than Toyotas little trucks.

The compact Toyota 30 mpg may get you there, but is it really a truck? Over time with income rising and paying off my home, I am not sacrificing the benefit of what a full size truck is about.

There are also more choices than buying bare bones work trucks with V6's. I'll take 13-15 mpg, which is half the mpg of the little trucks, but they perform.

The newest GM's are absolutely great... I cannot comment on Aveos on a truck review, or even basic work trucks, even the Ford F-150 as I did not test drive or have owned any new ones.

If you can afford a nice 3/4 ton diesel full size no compromise pickup with 4 wheels, it will be a domestic.

I do not like the higher fuel prices, but buying less fuel to have less of a very small limited application truck again makes no sense. I could go backwards, downsize my toys I tow, and not be able to do half of the things such as my home I've renovated myself. Taking 2 trips if even possible to bring home materials seems senseless as well. Why buy a small truck if you maximize a full size trucks potential at home and on weekends? I am not a contractor or a farmer, but I see the benefit every bit as they do owning one. I am not the exception as my circle of friends, power boaters etc. are driving nicely equipped full size domestics and do not run the little trucks. They can't do it. I buy what performs, not what will never be able to tackle the applications ever.