Comments: 1-15, 16-30, 31-45, 46-60, 61-75, 76-79
Alright then, I am a huge ford fan, come to think about, I don''t really like the E49 charger. although I do not like them, I must admit they were fast. They were the fastest 2 door car, but the falcon GT HO Phase 3 was the fastest 4 door car in Australia. The ford falcon will always blow the doors off a E49 charger.
Go the ford falcon!
Charger 14.40 second quarter mile
GT 14.45 second quarter mile.
In 1995 Holden printed around 50,000 brochures proclaiming their VS GTS-R was 'The new fastest accelerating australian production car" After testing the VS GTS-R it pulled 14.45 quarter mile and the brochures had to be destroyed.
The charger was marginally quicker to 160km/h than the ford, at which speed the ford would begin to pull past the charger.
The ford 351cu made 380HP (quite respectable) which equates
to 1.08 HP per Cu. If the 351 was a 265 it would produce
265*1.08 = 286HP.
The Chrysler 265cu made 302Hp, which equates to 1.14HP per cubic in, thus if the 265 was as a 351 would equate to 265*1.14 = 400hp (flat)
The hemi six was definitly something to be reckoned with, and it is true they have pulled high 13 passes on modern rubber in standard form. But based purely on what is written from the road tests at the time, on both the XY GT Phase III and the RT e49 charger, the charger is quicker down the quarter mile by.5 of second, and quicker to 160km/h, at which after that speed the ford begins to pull past it. Although I have not heard of reports of XY's on modern rubber, but it would no doubt improve their quarter mile time by a similar amount.
If ford had have had the oppurtunity to develop the phase 4, things could/would have been different, I can't help, but also wonder what chryslers E55 charger 340 six pack would have had in return.
What I have stated above (besides from my opinions etc), are facts taken from various motor magazines from the era.
I have no bias between either of the cars, and am actualy a holden fan.
People can argue, about figures, but the tests have been done and nothing can be changed. Both cars are considered icons of australain motoring, and both deserve equal amounts of respect. Denying a paticual piece of machinery respect simpily becuase of it's badge is utter ignorance to the truth. Opinions based on the belief that a badge can change the quality of engineeing and workmanship of a particular car can be considered to come from the same minds that concieve that a person is inferior becuase of their race.
I'm not a fanatic either way, but, it would seem to me that all should sing the praises of the Charger for not only the engineering required to achieve similar if not better performance results than the falcon, but to do this with its significantly less amount of cylinders & cubic inches.
This has been very good reading. I have a vh charger with a 440.not sure on horse power yet.
The charger certainly rules, that's why I want to get one. I'm getting my liscence soon and I really want an E38, E49 or E55 charger. Does anyone know where I could get one?
Well boys the E49 is austalia's fastest production car and as for a phase three blowing off the E49 is only a dream. and as for the phase four three of them were race cars and one was a show car and the E55 would have killed it if it wasn't killed off so stop fighting and except the E49 as australian's fastest production car!!!
Good reading. it seems like all who write about the two most argued speed muscle cars really know their stuff. and that realy good to see, i also have a vh charger out came the 265 and in with the 440.the 265 ran realy well I just wanted that v8 sound so I went for the 440 it has the good bit to make it happy looking forward to the future drive of my vh charger.
Maybe the Charger was the fastest, but to end all speculation, if looks count for a deciding vote the Charger wins any argument!
I bought my 6pack from a family of GT owners (one black duck had the R/T). They stated that they would never sell their Fords, but the Charger ate their cars and was undeniably faster for a "Wog Box"!
As for me... I appreciate all muscle cars of the era and think both cars are amazingly equal! A true enthusiast can appreciate all the brands, but will undoubtely have a preference...I'll stick to my Charger thanks.
Now lets talk about Australian content boys! Ford imported engines... Holden imported engines...Chrysler imported carbies, but the rest of the car was Aussie designed and built! I'm an Aussie and I drive THE Aussie Musclecar.
And so did the Kiwi's :)
It would be nice to see the expression on the Phase 3 lovers heads after they've been for a spin in an E49.
They will push you back in the seat harder and go around corners quicker and stop sooner, full stop. Anyone who denies this hasn't had the pleasure of having ever been in one.
It was easy for the Ford people to slot in Mustang bits to make a race car. The Charger on the other hand was developed completely in Australia and won many races in Australia and New Zealand, without any factory backing. They were ALL privateers. Only the "big one" at Bathurst eluded them.
The Ford on the other hand had massive factory backing and used American muscle to make it stop and go. Hardly an "Australian" icon compared to the Charger.
Resto'd E49's will do high 13's with modern rubber, and in modified naturally aspirated form, many have done low 11's. Lets not forget this is a six cylinder we are talking about.
The next step would've been the E55 340 six pack which had admittedly been developed in the States, but in the relatively light Charger would've been very difficult to catch. These 340's were competitive with the big blocks never mind the 351, and would've had a superior top speed with its high rpm characteristics.
Today one has to spend over 60/70 grand to purchase a vehicle just as quick, and that is over 30 years later.
That's the way it is Ford lovers.
Hey I'm 15 and I have two chargers a worked 265 with fuel injection and a 340 standard and they both go hard.
Go the charger.
Test results from reputable Aussie car magazines from the early 70's confirm some interesting information previously noted in prior comments.
From different mags with different testers some of the times recorded are amazingly consistent.
I am and have been an E49 fan since I was twelve, reading every comparison test and road test including the E49 that I could get my hands on.
The figures below show the consistently recorded times for the E49 and Phase 3.
E49 0 - 100km/h = 6.1sec (not 6.4) o - 160km/h = 14.1sec
1/4 mile = 14.4sec
Phase 3 0 - 100km/h 6.4sec 0 - 160km/h = 14.4 + 14.5 (equal in number of times recorded) 1/4 = 14.4sec.
After 160km/h the Phase 3 was definitely quicker and had a higher top speed 240km/h versus 211km/h.
As reported the E49 was the quickest Australian production up to 160km/h and the Falcon was the fastest 4 door in the world when released. The Falcon's claim was very short lived as the mighty Benz was released soon after.
The difference is, and some might say it is a play on words (but it is as reported), fastest and quickest are not terms used to identify the same vehicle capabilities. The Phase 3 was faster, but the E49 was quicker.
There is a strange twist to this story that no one has listed. A Phase 2 tested by Wheels that was fitted with the optional Hi Ratio diff (can't recall the ratio) ran these figures consistently: 0 - 100km/h = 6.2sec
o - 160km/h = I can't recall, but it was quicker than the Phase 3 but slower than the E49, 1/4 = almost broke my heart, but the truth is it ran 14.2sec.
This Phase 2 had options that were available to any purchaser of the GT.
So over all I appreciate both cars for what they were capable of given the available technology and believe both should stand together as the best "old style" muscle cars produced in Australia. I prefer the Charger, but that is just my opinion. It is a crying shame that all this performance would not allow either car to keep up with some Hi Po Japanese cars released here and in other world markets.
Too much pure technology and no character. Long live the real Muscle Cars.
Hello I own a 1972 VH r/t 2 barel charger. stock with 2 barell the charger has 164 kw and that is with no webers and that is quite impressive. ford fans I'm sorry that the gtho being the v8 351 cubes couldn't keep up with the straight
6 265 considering it was 86 cubes bigger :O. There is a book hey charger and that has got everything you need right there to break a ford fans heart.
GO THE CHARGER.
Whoever said that the falcon started to pass the charger on the 0 - 100mph test is an idiot... Think about it, if its 0 -60 time was 6.4 and its 0 -100 time was 14.4 that would mean it takes 8 seconds to gain 40mph.
This is not true... the time quoted is 0 - 100 - 0 mph test used to test both the acceleration AND braking.
How does that factor into the equation??? Well if the falcon started to pass the charger at the end of the strip that means the charger has much better braking capabilities than the falcon, a statement supported by many reviews and by simple logic... the charger was lighter and had much less cast iron hanging over the front wheels. Only thing is the charger had non-boosted brakes, but it is clear from the accleration figures that it had better braking than the falcon.
The writer of the last entry appears a little confused.
8 seconds for 100km/h - 160km/h is still quick by today's standards. Regarding 0 - 100mph - 0 times, this is old info so may have been surpassed now, but the fastest time for a road registered car I have seen for this test was 13.5seconds. This was in a Modified Porsche 911 Turbo (factory backed) that achieved 0 - 100Km/h in 3.2 seconds and 0 - 200Km/h in 9.0 seconds. My memory may have faded, but I believe the 0 - 160Km/h was 6.5 seconds.
Other previous writers have noted that above 100mph the GTHO was quicker than the E49. This relates to timed increments above 100mph not that magically the Falcon will pass the Charger at this speed. If side by side the Falcon would begin to reel the E49 in after reaching 100mph, but would not pass it until the speeds were approximately 115 - 120mph. The E49 would then run out of breath at approx 130mph whilst the GTHO would continue on to 142mph.
The 155mph quoted was the theoretical top speed given the gearing of the Falcon and not an achieved top speed. I believe Wheels Magazine Testers wound a GTHO out, on a slighty downhill gradient on the Hume Highway, to just shy of an indicated 150mph on the speedo. The Testers duly noted that speedo indications can be wildly inaccurate. I once modified my old Mini speedo to indicate 120mph when actually travelling at 80mph just to fool my friends. The legend grew very quickly about this "Hot" Mini.
As a reference to the 60 - 100mph increment the 350 HQ Monaro laid down these times:
0 - 60mph 7.9 sec, 0 - 100mph 22.3secs. Obviously over 14 seconds to add the extra 40mph. As the speed increases the acceleration rate decreases due to the power and torque required just to keep the car at high speed. Someone proficient in physics can explain in factual detail how it works, I'm not that smart.
This has been an interesting and memory provoking forum to read and be a part of so please let's not ruin it by putting down contributors.
One last note - No Commodore, factory direct, has recorded consistent sub six second 0 - 100Km/h times.
Also the BA Turbo Falcon is Faster than the E49 and GTHO at an achievable 245-250Km/h and has achieved 0 - 100Km/h times ranging from 6.2 - 6.5 seconds. This makes it
line-ball with the old guys between 6.3 - 6.5 seconds, but quicker at 6.2 seconds than both. The old guys only were timed to 96Km/h. Commodores claiming 6.0 seconds seem to lay times about 0.5 of a second slower consistently when put against the stopwatch. Very shortly a car will arrive on the scene that will leave no doubt as to the quickest Aussie production car. Where will it come from, your guess is as good as mine as all three Aussie Car producers are working on genuine high performance models. I say three as let's not forget Mitsubishi who build there large cars here.
If they built the Lancer Evo here they could already claim the title. Hmmm something to think about!