2nd Aug 2021, 18:48
Wrond again, nobody here mentioned red lining or changing oil every 50k. Our Vibe never even made it to 50k before the engine sludged, oil was changed every 3,000 miles and Toyota recommends it every 7,000. It was an easy engine to swap out I'll give them that. After the new engine we got rid of it to cut our losses while ahead.
3rd Aug 2021, 02:49
It’s cold spots in the block. You can change constantly and it's a design issue. Rather than deflect, why not acknowledge the flaws.
3rd Aug 2021, 03:17
Abuse and incorrect intervals are not the cause of Toyotas sludge problem. And yes the other manufacturers mentioned did have sludge issues also. Owners admit this on forums like this unlike Toyota owners. I can't believe people in denial about something that has been well documented.
3rd Aug 2021, 14:14
Do you even know how a PCV system works and what happens when it is clogged due to design flaws like Toyota? My guess would be no, seeing how you keep blaming it on owner neglect. Yeah 08:35 blew their motor on the highway, so automatically you assume that they were qualifying for an Indy car race.
3rd Aug 2021, 17:36
I can personally vouch for this person's comment about Toyota oil consumption problems.
We have 2005 Prius that has loved using oil from about 180k miles.
It turns out there is TSB about the fix for this and it involves replacing the pistons.
There is a second TSB that describes removing the spark plugs and injecting a special Toyota-supplied liquid in the cylinders and letting it soak for 24 hours.
Toyota did not put enough or large enough oiling holes in the piston ring lands and the rings freeze to the piston.
We have used Mobil one synthetic religiously and changed at regular intervals
Engine flush before an oil change fixes it temporarily, but then the rings gum up and she starts drinking oil again.
3rd Aug 2021, 18:37
You can blame Pontiac in that case, not Toyota. This car has a Pontiac name. Pontiac is the one putting their reputation behind it and didn’t bother putting their foot down if there were design flaws. Probably explains why they’re out of business. Wouldn’t be the first time. I had a 1990 Pontiac LeMans years ago. Was built by Daewoo, who also went out of business. The company with their name on the car is ultimately responsible for ensuring what goes in it can be trusted. Pontiac never really cared about such things.
4th Aug 2021, 14:05
Brand loyalty is blind sometimes. Compare a 1996 Tacoma to a non recommended 2018 Tacoma by Motor Trend with many issues. My best ever Toyota was my 77 Celica GT. Made in Japan. Paint quality exceptional. Even Honda’s Civics ands Accords are not the quality of a mid 90s era.
4th Aug 2021, 22:30
Oh yes you can! Pontiac did not specify an engine to their own design to be manufactured by Toyota. It's sold as a Toyota Voltz in Japan. It's a badge-engineered car with the Pontiac badge pasted on it with some minor cosmetic differentiators. The car was designed by Toyota and manufactured also in Japan. Pontiac may be ultimately responsible for dealing with anything they sold under their trade name, but this engine's reputation rests on Toyota.
5th Aug 2021, 17:33
The only thing that is GM manufactured in the Vibe is the audio system. The rest of the vehicle is unfortunately Toyota.
5th Aug 2021, 17:42
OK, so help me understand this. If someone blows the engine in the car under warranty, who pays for the replacement? You’re saying it’s Toyota because they designed the engine? I don’t think so.
6th Aug 2021, 18:19
I thought Toyota’s are indestructible and the best. Where’s the little Toyota truck guy? He’s probably astounded.
6th Aug 2021, 21:37
Toyota: designed the engine and the vehicle it went in and manufactured both.
Pontiac: made slight cosmetic changes to Toyota Matrix and sold it under their own name. Had NOTHING to do with the design or manufacturing.
6th Aug 2021, 22:46
No, whoever sold the car is liable for it, so Pontiac for warranty. But because the design and manufacturer is Toyota's, their REPUTATION is what takes the hit for that engine design. That's why with the new Supra, if people started buying it because it was a high-performance, well-handling sports car with a Toyota badge, and it starts breaking down because it has in fact an engine (as well as many electronic parts) from BMW, Toyota will need to cover it for warranty - but buyers and car fanatics will point the finger straight at BMW.
7th Aug 2021, 04:29
That maybe true; the head unit in the Vibe had a small readout on the display screen that provides the song and artist being played on a radio station at that moment like a lot of other Pontiac models. I strongly don't think this was available in the Matrix or any other Toyota for that matter.
7th Aug 2021, 18:34
Yeah but in the end it is not Pontiac's fault for whatever potential problems the Toyota engine provides.
7th Aug 2021, 20:47
Right, so Toyota can never lose with the endless excuse-makers for the brand, correct? If they design parts or a car for someone else, it’s their fault (Pontiac). If they accept a design from someone else (Supra), it still won’t be their fault. Imagine being an automaker who literally can’t lose. Pretty amazing.
8th Aug 2021, 22:07
No, no, no. If they design and build the engine (and car) for someone else, they have fault. If they accept an engine etc. (Supra from BMW), as mentioned, the finger is pointed AT BMW. Toyota stands for one very strong thing: reliability. If they chose to partner with BMW, sure they will accept the warranty issues, but the discussions will be on how bad the BMW engine is.
9th Aug 2021, 16:08
Got it. So, the company who was too lazy to make their own engine is blame-free. The one who actually provided it is a pariah. Good stuff.
9th Aug 2021, 17:17
So a Toyota engine that failed from small oil galleries and cold pockets within areas of a Toyota engine block in a Toyota is Toyota’s fault correct? Strictly adhered to oil change intervals and quality oil and filters of course.
10th Aug 2021, 13:53
I wouldn’t get my hopes up. There’s a handy word service managers like to use…… Denied. Coupled with abuse, over revving, driving hard before warm, redlined, low coolant level, maintenance record sketchy. Then you pay.
10th Aug 2021, 17:52
Exactly. The redlining point came up earlier in this thread already. Hardly Toyota’s fault.
10th Aug 2021, 22:14
Depends on what blame you are talking about. Decided to get someone's engine instead of making your own with your own name? Yep! The maker who sold it to someone to market in their own name? Yep!
2nd Aug 2021, 15:08
Sorry, but incorrect. Any vehicle that gets abused, where the owner refuses to change the oil at the correct intervals will lead to sludging. In any case the engines that Toyota produced that had this happen were recalled anyway. And while it's clear you guys just love to jump all over Toyota, Chrysler, VW and Audi also had complaints about oil sludging.