2002 Ford Puma from UK and Ireland - Comments

Since we are getting the cutting and pasting out:

"Right. Firstly, I want you to realise that all my comments come relative to MY experience of driving cars." Therefore MY OPINION and MY EXPERIENCES. I have only come up against CTR a couple of times and, as I am sure you will say, they were obviously not racing properly. Of course, if you were there I would have barely started and you would have broken the speed barrier, but that didn't happen on the times I raced. To give the same example as before, the BMW 330 was a close race. What I was trying to illustrate was that in real world conditions my car is as much fun as more expensive machinery.

You cannot argue with this because it is MY opinion. If you disagree then see my title: "superb, but not for everyone".

NOW...

1 - you still do not respond to the many professionals who hold the puma in high regard and not the ctr, etc, but again, don't worry: we still all love you.

2 - "That's great, why not meet up with the Clio 182 and Civic R owners and show them your bottle on the dragstrip!

Unless it's a bottle of NOS, you will be left behind! Ha Ha Ha." WELL DONE. You have completely ignored EVERYTHING: it is not about speed. I will assume that you are merely not reading and will not dwell on this any further.

3 - "The only thing that I have claimed is that my CTR will outperform a 1.7l Puma (speed, handling, whatever) " AFRAID NOT. Its the "whatever" where your car falls apart. It is not as fun as mine IN MY OPINION.

If you don't like it then keep your car and I am happy for you. Well done. Equally, there are many people who have a Puma and keep it. That's good too.

I am not trying to convert you to my way of thinking (as you clearly are trying to do to me) so lighten up. I have responded to all queries, but you seem to completely discount the possibility that you just misread me, whilst simultaneously not responding to my comments. Seriously, if you have any serious questions I will answer them, but you are really ruining this forum by being so petty about it and trying to read between the lines.

Time has already shown that the Puma is seen affectionately and the CTR is not. This doesn't mean it is incapable, and that is not what I am arguing, so grow up!

HMMM! Interesting debate, I too have a puma 1.7 & can only agree with the original author. The handling is far superior to any other hot hatch or small coupe. My car accelerates away from clio 182's with no problem. I had a full car of four people the other day & a clio 182 pulled up along side at @ about 30 mph I just accelerated hard in 4th gear up to 75 mph the clio had no chance against my puma. I could hear the driver changing gear on the limiter trying to keep up. I have tustled with a couple of those japanese mitsubishi EVO's on windy roads as well, they are pretty impressive, but I really did not have to break too much of a sweat to pull a sizable gap on them in the windy stuff.

So before you all start slating the author I suggest you should pay some respect to the ford puma, They are a a real sports car.

Rob Hawk.

I have owned 3 Pumas, a 1.4, a 1.6 and now the full monty 1.7i VCT version. There is nothing on the road that can touch these cars for handling and the 1.7i VCT engine built by the Cosworth F1 Team is a modern marvel.

If you take the car to your local Superchips dealer, they will change the software and release the full potential of the engine. The new 2.5 V8 F1 engines produce 800 BHP, so it is not a problem to get half that much from the 1.7i which is modelled on half of the old 3.5 Cosworth DFV Unit, the most successful engine in F1 history.

With the full power unleashed the car is as fast as anything in a straight line and the cornering remains unaffected on half throttle, though anything above that requires expert powersliding techniques and should be used on track only!

The reason for the conflict on this post is that some people have driven standard 123 BHP cars and others have driven the full 350+ BHP chipped cars, which are a different animal altogether!

(Original Author here:)

Thank you for your comments: I was beginning to think that all the Puma owners had run away!

I was just reading the current Evo Magazine today (issue 91) and look what I found:

page 169:

FORD PUMA + Everything - Nothing (5stars)

and on page 167:

HONDA CIVIC TYPE-R + Potent and great value - Look divide opinion, DUFF steering (4stars)

But what would they know right? I mean, they are only highly respected professionals...

(NOTE to editors: These are exact quotations so I am not trying to claim ownership over these. If it breaches any copyright then feel free to take them out)

Guys guys guys, come on now or it will be fisty cuffs soon lol. my auntie owned a puma 1.7 which I drove and thought hmm bit lack luster in performance, bit cramped inside especially the back seats with a tiny tiny boot. handling was OK, but nothing special to shout home about. i also took out a puma for a test drive one day coz I was bored and I like driving different cars and experiencing them for myself forgetting other peoples reviews. i found a good B road and decidedly thrashed the pants off the poor car (not mine so hey why not) on the same day I popped round to the peugeot garage and they had a 106gti there which I took for a spin on the same stretch of road...WOW! the difference was instantly noticable the pug handled much more crisp and sure footed on the limit and I could take corners faster as it seemed to pull harder through the gears with more of a kick.. worse brakes tho.

Now since then I have driven the ford focus st170...outstanding handling, but far too slow. (not got round to the new ST yet.) The leon cupra and cupra R (amazing brakes) the civic type R.. very nice good solid car, engine is a peach when you get in the power band, and my mates clio 182..nicely torqued engine and good handling, but of a cheap feel to the plastics.

Now with that out the way I would just like to say they all have their plus and minus points, but please don't put the puma into a league above it, its cruel to the car for having to try too hard to compete against opposition that out classes it on pretty much any road.

O and for your information I own a 97 Honda Integra type R DC2 and would have taken you all on round a track guys for a bit of fun, altho I now feel it would be a bit unfair since I have added a turbo and running around 260bhp and only weighing 1060kg.Going to Japfest on May 20th at castle coombe if you all wanna come... sorry I was speaking to the owners of the real cars (clio 182 and civic type R) not the lack luster puma... unless you really really want to mate, but I'm really not sure if my car can keep up with your legendary puma.

P.s. Are you a driving god?

The only way you'll get 300 bhp + out of this engine and still have it half driveable is to use a turbo or supercharger. A chip on its own will give you 20 bhp on an absolutely perfect day, and anyone claiming any more is lying. Chip tuning only gives big gains on turbo cars or in conjuction with a SHEDLOAD of other work.

Why are you using specific output from an F1 engine to justify this claim? An F1 engine revs to 20,000 RPM, is built with materials that cost more per kg than a complete Ford Puma, and is designed to last less than 1,000 miles between rebuilds. It's not designed to idle, to lug a heavy bodyshell (compared to an F1 car, a Puma is a bucket of lard), sit in traffic or do 10,000 miles between services. In a road car, an F1 engine would last about 2 minutes, so comparing power outputs is pointless.

The Ford Puma is not even in the same class as the Civic Type R or the Clio 182. Why are you guys even bothering with this pointless debate?!!!

CTR owner back…

Look this is just getting stupid now. I’m sure that I too can find both bad and good reviews for all of the cars that we have mentioned on this forum, but what’s the point.

What you seem to forget is that I make no claims about my CTR being the ultimate driving machine, in fact I know that it’s not perfect – I drive it every day so am well aware of its bad points!

I don’t care if it’s not seen as affectionate as the Puma – if I want an affectionate friend then I’ll get a dog!

However the claim that I make and will continue to make is that my CTR will out handle and out perform your 1.7l Puma. This is my point and I’m more than happy to prove it as I have said time and time again.

The Puma owner that raced the Clio 182 is obviously having a laugh!

The 350bhp Puma owner is obviously off his head if he thinks a chip will give him those power gains! In fact if your still reading then let us all know where we can have such a miracle performed on our cars. I just figured out that that such an increase on my engine would produce over 550bhp, bargain!

My final point. I too have given a little praise to the Puma on this forum, but am I really wrong in saying that it is out classed when compared to today’s modern hot hatches? and I don’t mean how much you want to give it a cuddle or how affectionately it is seen!

I don’t want to here about my “duff steering” either – I mean lets just see how badly my “duff steering” affects my driving ability when we are comparing the cars around the track, or any other driving test you wish challenge my CTR!

The CTR is a very average car with a storming engine. It's quick, but uninvolving in my opinion. It also looks like a van with windows.

The Clio is a much better car all round, and is probably the pick of the current hot hatch crop quite comfortably. Crap build quality though.

The Puma has the best chassis of the three by quite a margin with fabulous steering and more throttle adjustability at the limit than both the two cars above put together. Sadly its lack of power puts it in a lower league. For fun, it's well up there though.

There. Can we stop arguing?

By the way, I'll personally stick with my Peugeot 306 GTI-6 (gently tweaked to a dyno proven 178 bhp) which I still reckon would paste any of them across a really challenging bit of road. Nothing flows across a typical bumpy back road, understeers less, or changes direction quite like it, and certainly nothing provides the same level of constant feel and feedback. Still the best hot hatch ever made with the possible exception of the 205 GTI 1.9, but the 306 does 95% of it while being quicker, and infinitely more comfy and useable.

Peugeot were the daddies at front wheel drive chassis throughout the 90's, and relinquished the crown through starting to produce soft bloated monstrosities like the 307 rather than the competition catching up!

The peugeot 306 owner is having a laugh isn't he?

The Civic R is not an average car, it is arguably the best normally aspirated hot hatch of the last few years!

The Clio 182 is the argument against the above, and no 306 owner can possibly ctiticise the interior plastics!

The Puma had a good chassis in 1996 when compared to cars like the 306 and XR3i, but neither can keep up with the best of todays hot hatches.

As for your 178 bhp 306 being the daddy, it is both heavier and less powerful than the Civic R and 182, so unless you are Colin McRae you are not going to keep up!

CTR owner here…

I’m happy with that! I have spent the last 4 years of my life driving a GTI-6 (part exchanged for my CTR), 1998 (R) Diablo Red, facelift model with half leather seat, air con and much better spec that my Civic. Never had a problem with it in 4 years (except the cam belt snapping at 50k before it was due!) anyway 16 new valves later and £1200 lighter she was back on the road! Fitted the usual K&N and full scorpion exhaust system and although I never had it dyno’d I reckon it probably had a little more that the stock bhp. Can’t say it enough, it was an absolutely awesome car, in some ways I wish I have never had sold it, but it had done 89k when we parted and needed something newer, with guaranteed reliability (?) but still with some grunt! New house forces sale and all that! Still have the Clarion autochanger and original metal airbox if ya interested?!

Although I am still getting used to the handling of the CTR I doubt whether I will ever be able to keep up with my old GTI-6 on the twisty stuff. I am planning to take the CTR to Snetterton for the day so guess I’ll be able to test it to its limits there. I suppose the different between them in my opinion is that every time I get into my CTR, plant the throttle and hit the VTEC I can imagine the biggest grin across my face! Have fitted a Typhoon K&N so it sounds just amazing 2!

Anyway, I think theres enough banter on this forum and guess its time to give it a rest. It would have been good though to see us all on the track though! All of the cars have their good/bad points, but I guess ultimately its down to opinion.

To the Puma owner – I have never said that it wasn’t a good car, it obviously brings you lots of enjoyment, great! Whenever I see a “blue hue” coming up behind me…

I’ve since fallen in love with my best mates STI Impreza, I didn’t believe a car could have so much grip and power, its almost unbelievable! I am now in the process of persuading the Mrs so watch this space guys…!!

My integra would wipe the floor with your pug...sorry.

You should all grab a drive in a honda integra type r... then you will know what grip is truely all about... and to the above comment... in the dry it actually out grips the subaru STI I have video footage to prove it. read review on the integra from a guy that owned the STI RA special edition one with the 300bhp, he actually traded it in for an integra coz it grips better.306 gti stands no chance... far far far too heavy! the teg (pre 98 model) actually weighs in at 1060kg..that's lighter than a clio 172 cup!!!

O and has a limited slip differential which helps massively on cornering grip which the clio, the civic and the 306 all lack.

I dare say it would. If it were a hot hatch, your comment would be relevant. You can buy a Porsche 968 Club Sport for similar money which is better / faster still. What's your point?

To the guy above that - nice response. Someone not waving their willy on this thread - what a refreshing change.

Well the integra has 2 doors,4 usable seats, a big boot with a hatch opening and if you get the japanese edition the same 197bhp figure that the civic type R produces. OK I admit that it is classed as a coupe, but then again so is an old shape civic vti coupe, and I'm sure you would have no objection to pitting that against the other hot hatches of the day in a straight comparison.