18th Jul 2005, 16:18

The 69 GTO and any true muscle car (keyword is TRUE... a ricer is not a muscle car) is going to be faster than pretty much everything even when it's stock. 450+ horse Chevelles, 425+ horse Challengers, 370+ horse Trans Ams...they'll whip a ricer no matter how much junk you put on it. Anyone who buys a civic and puts a fart cannon muffler and wing on it and calls it fast... well they're just plain stupid (check it out man! I put cold air induction, nitrous, twin turbos, and headers on my civic and it puts out 200 horsepower!) Don't mess with a real performance car i.e. LS6 Chevelle when it can run 13 sec. 1/4 miles at 112 mph STOCK.

30th Oct 2005, 01:13

Hi, "ricer" hater here. This comment won't add any interesting points or anything, just wanted to say this:

First, I'm on the muscle car side. Don't have a muscle car, just a car. A guy a few posts back has an '83 Grand Prix making 853hp. The guy with the Supra posting before him says 800 "documented" hp. (My dreams can be documented too.) Even if he could achieve that impossible number with only a turbo or two, the difference is, the 400 engine can hold that number on a dyno until he runs out of gas. The Supra, meanwhile, will crack his block or worse before the V8 is even up to speed.

To the ricers: Do you feel cool coming to a true muscle car page and saying your stupid Civic-thing could beat a GTO? Honestly. At least we all get a good laugh. I'd get the best laugh if I saw a ricer try to beat a GTO from a stoplight. If the vibrations from the V8 which came standard with POWER (not an option on ricers) didn't shake the ricer apart, it might be fun to watch.

30th Oct 2005, 06:16

My friend and I use to ride around in his new 1969 Ram Air III Convertible 4 speed. It drew a lot of great attention then and now. It was beautiful, great performance and was convertible! I found a 1969 SS Camaro 4 speed kept many years, but it was not a nice as my friends Pontiac. Sorry Civics do not float my boat!

31st Oct 2005, 04:29

I will smoke all your gtos easily. I have a civic type r tuned to 657hp @wheels.

31st Oct 2005, 19:30

Great you have a Civic... You must be enamored with the GTO otherwise you would only be interested in the Honda reviews only. We understand your need to prove yourself. In the end its still just a Civic not a legend. I see no need to read their reviews as they do not interest me whatsoever.

1st Nov 2005, 15:34

I agree with the review above, and you should show some respect for muscle cars like the GTO. I'm not your "weekend warrior", an "import tuner", or an old person who has too much money to spend on toys like a GTO. I'm just your average 20 year old college student who is a fan of both domestic and import cars. You have to understand one thing, muscle cars are classics and they will never make cars as great as them ever again. They came OUT OF THE FACTORY with most of the time at least 300 horsepower to the wheels, and a 69 GTO with a 455 could easily put out over 400 horsepower at the wheels. Not to mention it was incredibly cheap and easy to add even more horsepower and torque to these monsters on the road. It was a different time because car manufacturers had little to no restrictions on making these "street machines" incredibly fast, gas was dirt cheap, emissions standards did not exist, and these cars really gave you your "bang for your buck" when new.

I'm sorry to bust your stones, but you bought a Honda civic that did not come out of the factory with 300 or more horsepower (most likely had 92 to 160 VTEC or not). Plus it was not designed for horsepower (except SI models), just fuel economy/reliablity. To get 700 horesepower out of your car along with making it a presentable street machine probably put a giagantic hurt on your wallet, or took away that down-payment on a Suburban home. I know because parts for imports along with trying to squeeze a lot of horsepower out of little displacement becomes very costly from my experience. However, let me be the first to congratulate you if you did manage to get close to 700 horsepower at the wheels out of your Civic, as its very impressive even to me.

To everyone on this review site in the infamous words of Rodney King, "Can't we all just get along?" Try to appreciate both sides, both import and domestic, because we are all after the same goals of having a fun, fast, and cool ride. For the import guys, try to show some respect to the muscle cars, because if it wasn't for them you wouldn't have an aftermarket for your car. For the domestic guys, the "rice rockets" deserve some repect too since they are trying to match the speed, style, and grace of the muscle cars that once owned the streets long ago. So next time, when that "muscle car" pulls up next to your import, give the owner a "thumbs up". Same thing goes for the domestic car guys, if I can do it, you can too if it legitmately fast. I give an exception to those "fake imports better know as rice burners" whose only mods are stickers and altezzas because they are a joke.

By the way, my import collection included a 96 Eagle Talon TSI AWD (summer DD/ran high 12s at the track), 95 Honda Civic SI Hatch (sold), and a 93 Eagle Talon ESI (former daily driver/brother's now).

My domestic collection includes a 87 Mercury Grand Marquis LS (Daily drag/upgraded to HO 5.0), 70 Chevelle SS Clone (MY summer ride/project), and a 89 Chevrolet IROC-Z Camaro (Stock 350/dad's ride).

4th Feb 2006, 21:32

You can compare ricers and muscle cars all you like. We all know that ultimate performance does not come from 2.0L engines. The fastest accelerating piston-engine vehicles on the planet are the Top Fuel dragsters. Don't see many of those running a turbo four, do we? Let's face it, no matter what side of the fence you're on, a tough big motor will always produce more grunt than a tough small motor. Handling? Fuel economy? That's another story...

5th Feb 2006, 10:49

"I will smoke all your gtos easily. I have a civic type r tuned to 657hp @wheels." Thank you for that comment! It was a rather dreary day, and I really needed a good belly laugh!

5th Feb 2006, 14:00

Hey guys, about the guy who says his Civic has 657hp, consider this. The horsepower number is found by the following formula: HP = torque * (RPM / 5250). If we assume that he managed to make 200 lb-ft of torque, which is quite an achievement (Subaru WRX, not STi, had 217 lb-ft. with the 2.0L), then putting that number into the formula, we see that to make 657 HP, his engine would be rotating at 17,246 RPM. We have a word for that where I come from. Polite society calls it "fertilizer" instead.

Even if he made 300 lb-ft (Subaru WRX STi with the 2.5L made this), the engine would have to be at a still-unlikely 11,497 RPM. If he has made such strides in engine performance, I hope he's at home when Porsche calls him to ask where they went wrong. Don't drive that Civic in hell; the roads might be icy.