26th Jan 2007, 12:55
Yes, many North American workers are and will be losing their jobs. I think we all know that. Yes, each of the Big 3 have lost money and market share. We all know that too. But we all know, at least 99.999% of us do, that these companies will survive and regain market share and once again, be profitable.
GM, Ford and Chrysler are providing consumers with vehicles that are as good as if not better than any other manufacturer. Bias and off the cuff berating of the Big 3 is now more of a sport, rather than factual and concise criticism. Time is of the essence and so is our support.
Like I said, the facts must be credible otherwise the debate is pointless and all rebuttals rudimentary. The Cobalt is an excellent value. The majority of the reviews indicate that people are satisfied with the car. So why do others cling to their bias and off the cuff berating of the car yet, they have never owned or likely will own one? I've viewed the comments on Toyotas, Hondas and the like. There are lots of unsatisfied owners there as well.
That's what I'm saying.
26th Jan 2007, 15:40
<<But we all know, at least 99.999% of us do, that these companies will survive and regain market share and once again, be profitable.>.
We do? How do we know that?
Bet you said the same thing about AMC.
Sorry, but the world has changed. There was even a story in last week's BusinessWeek that stated GM's new goal is NOT marketshare, but to build better cars in its niche and hold on to that niche.
Ford and Chrysler are both setting themselves up to be broken up and sold as individual parts.
26th Jan 2007, 15:44
I've driven the Cobalt. Its interior and other fittings are subpar compared to a Honda Civic much less a Honda Fit. It's a car that is competitive for 1995, not 2007.
It's just another in a long line of mediocrity (like the new Avenger/Sebring from Chrysler) that will fill rental car fleets and only be sold on low prices.
27th Jan 2007, 10:00
I for one, like the design of the Sebring, but I also like the current design of the Toyota Corolla, which should be nominated "the most mediocre car of the decade". Regardless, both are appealing to me.
I disagree with your comment about the Cobalt. I've never driven one, but I had the opportunity to view a Pontiac G5 at the dealership where I purchased my Pontiac Montana SV6. I've owned Toyota's and a Kia and the interior fit and finish of the G5 is in my opinion is better than ether manufacturers offerings for similar vehicles. An acquaintance of mine purchased the new cab forward design Civic with the instrument cluster in the centre of the dash. I like the design, reminds be of the original Mini of the sixties as well as the cab forward Chrysler's of the nineties.
The Honda fit is more or less a car designed for the younger buyer. Personally, I don't like it. It reminds me of a Yugo on steroids. It is versatile, but it's not much bigger than a Mercedes Smart car and is on the same level as the Yaris, fit and finish wise. Wash and wear interior with removable parts that rattle and vibrate when the cars is driven. My son likes it though, he thinks it's cool. He's not in to quality or substance and is quite willing to pay an obnoxious price for a Fit, $24,000. Now I know why they named it Fit, I'd have one if I had to pay that price for something like that.
27th Jan 2007, 10:44
In which parallel universe is your son paying $24K for a Fit? The Fit tops out at $16K unless your son is adding $10K of aftermarket options. In fact, even a loaded Civic doesn't top $24K, and that's a class higher.
What proof do you have that this car has rattles? The Cobalt I drove had rattles, but the Fit I drove was solid.
28th Jan 2007, 05:42
Maybe in the U.S. but here in Canada, equipped with auto, stereo, etc it's grossly overpriced. Honda is directly marketing this vehicle to the younger buyer who will spend the money for this thing regardless, "it's really cool"! It's not a good value for the money in my opinion.
So you've driven a Cobalt and now a Fit, any others that we should know about? Yes, I've ridden in a Fit, but I have not driven one, and yes, it had some rattles and a dash vibration. I will admit that it was about 20 below not counting the wind chill, but it did rattle and vibrate. What proof do we have that you've actually driven these cars? If you drove a Fit then You'd know what I'm eluding to.
When it comes to fit and finish, the Cobalt is on par with any other similar brand. The Cobalt is and excellent value without exception. It's not a perfect example of engineering excellence, but nether is a Honda, Toyota or any other brand in the price range.
I'm sure some Cobalt's may have a squeak or two on occasion, but so did my Corolla and especially the Kia Sedona I recently dumped. My wife drives An Audi A4 and it has it share of squeaks and rattles, every vehicle does, and almost everybody, at least 99.999% realizes this in the real world.
28th Jan 2007, 09:24
Unlike you, I actually took the vehicle on a 30 minute test drive on the highway, city streets, and up very steep hills. It did not do anything other than driving like a sports car (it is faster through a slalom than one Ferrari model according to Car and Driver) with no extraneous noise.
Test driving ANY car at 20 below is ridiculous and is in no way a valid comparison.
And FYI, no BMW I ever owned (five of them) had "squeaks and rattles" regardless of mileage.
29th Jan 2007, 10:05
Automotive manufacturers constantly test vehicles at temperatures well beyond 20 below. If anything, you'll quickly find out if the vehicles heater is sufficient to clear the windscreen and heat the interior. You will also determine just how capable the vehicle operates in typical winter driving conditions and where all the rattles and squeaks are. This is when we test drive a car, not when it's warm and sunny out. We do have six months of winter.
I think the writers for Car & Driver have had one too many Popiscles. How anyone would say that a Honda Fit performs better through a slalom than a Ferrari, without extraneous noise by the way, is dreaming in Technicolour. That is the most rediculous example of product bias I've ever heard. Next thing we'll hear is that the Fit can fly and have babies. Those types of nonsense editorials are published to convince gullible buyers who believe that if it's in print, it must be fact! Who do you think pays these writers to write such gibberish? Who wrote the editorial, do you know?
BMW's are nice, I wish I could afford one. If I could, you'd never see me behind the wheel of a Honda Fit. I've never owned a BMW or driven in one so, I guess I'll take your word that non of the five you've owned have ever had a rattle or vibration. Too bad for BMW though, if the Fit outperformed a Ferrari, it must certainly blow the doors of any BMW.