8th Nov 2011, 08:13

I never said there are no bad Toyotas. I know every line has their lemons, and there are always inherent problems with mass production of any product. What I meant is, it is tiring to see the same posts about Toyota's rankings at J.D. Powers and Consumer Reports. If you've had a bad experience with Toyota, then start a thread about the car you had trouble with. To come onto another thread and say "Never again" or "Toyota's are junk" etc., etc. with no examples of factual issues makes no real sense, and does nothing to help the overall purpose of this site. I've had some really bad experiences with certain brands, but I don't post to threads on them, just to say they are junk over and over again. I have provided specific examples of the problems I have had, and the outcome from the dealer and the manufacturer in order to help anyone considering the purchase of said vehicle. Saying Toyota ranks below Ford really says nothing helpful to anyone.

And sorry, but I like posting on here when it makes sense to do so. This thread has just been dragging on and on, with pointless arguments that help no one.

8th Nov 2011, 13:03

We bought new Honda Accords over and over every few years. We didn't even shop around. They changed little. We fell into the Honda import hype. We had drivetrain issues and quit buying them. Our last was a 2003.

8th Nov 2011, 20:04

I've been helping my friend keep his 2009 Toyota going for the past year. It's one problem after another.

It won't hold an alignment because the unibody is so poorly built that it sags from the weight of the car.

It developed lots of rattles, and I have re-attached most of the puny plastic fasteners that hold the entire front bumper and grill together.

The brake pads, as with all imports, wore out in a third of the time they should have.

The heat shield came loose on the catalytic converter.

The only car I've seen that was more poorly built was our Honda Civic.

9th Nov 2011, 12:18

I think the recurring issue showing up in these comments, is that the comments that veer into the same old import versus domestic trap, read like a broken record. There are a lot of vague, anecdotal, and probably completely made-up stories being thrown out there, just to try and "prove" their side of the argument. A lot of these comments are totally contrary to reality.

Yes - ALL car manufactures are bound to have some duds out there. Likewise, some individual cars of a model that get overwhelmingly positive reviews are going to have issues. Likewise, someone might own a car that receives overwhelmingly bad reviews, that miraculously never had an issue.

Making broad, sweeping statements about an entire industry, car manufacturer, or whether it's foreign or domestic is pointless, and isn't accomplishing anything. There are American workers producing Japanese cars and Japanese workers making American cars. It's the same with everything. Everything has been componetized down to a level where when you open the box, the same stuff is inside. I don't see these same arguments being made for PC's and cell phones. For some reason people think cars are different. They aren't. They're made using globally engineered platforms, and put together with global components from companies around the world. Your "American" car is probably just as American as a Toyota, VW, Nissan, or whatnot.

Lastly, it's equally pointless to slap some sort of label on something that has a foreign/domestic label. The notion that something is inferior because its parent company is in such-and-such country is ridiculous. That sort of logic is totally outdated. The world of manufacturing has totally changed. The idea that a factory in such and such country, starts with a pile of iron ore and raw materials, with completed cars coming out the other end, with the whole thing having been built with on-site produced parts is antiquated. So it's not like it's at all accurate to just say that "Oh - that car is inferior because it's from XXX country." Because the parts in it probably are also in multiple cars from multiple brands, and of those parts, chances are they're made in the USA, Canada, Brazil, China, Japan, and so on.

Either way, I am sure these same comments will be made regardless. Read them with a grain of salt.

9th Nov 2011, 16:39

See, this is what I mean... over and over. You posted about this car like two years ago, and about 15 times since. The only Corolla I have ever heard of with a sagging frame. It was a one time isolated case of a defective car, okay, we get it. I have never heard of anyone with any brand of car that had any sagging frames on them. It would be pretty tough to do in a unibody car anyhow, and that is what every Corolla is and has been for decades now. I think if this were a problem, it would have come out as such across the entire model lineup by now, don't you? Since there are millions of Corollas all around the world, and your friend's is the first I have heard of this happening to, I tend to think it is a one time thing.

9th Nov 2011, 17:38

In today's news, it was reported that Toyota is recalling another half-million-plus cars due to very serious safety defects. It should be pretty obvious that Toyota long ago abandoned building high-quality, safe vehicles.

11th Nov 2011, 08:05

Yeah, we'll see if this one really affects them. So far they are still above domestics on quality, so I am thinking this one will come to pass as well, and their loyal followers will continue to buy Toyota's. Maybe that is what irks domestic car people on sites like this. Toyota continues to have a loyal following, and they also continue to dominate all of the ratings sources that are quoted on here, even with recall after recall. Imagine just how far ahead they would be if they hadn't made any manufacturing errors.

11th Nov 2011, 17:37

I just read that Toyota and Honda sales continue to fall, while GM, Ford and Chrysler are posting huge gains. GM has already knocked Toyota off in both world sales and U.S. sales. It's pretty obvious that a lot of former Toyota/Honda owners are now driving domestics. Most Fusion and Malibu owners that I know traded an Accord or Camry in on them. It's pretty obvious that disposable transmissions (Honda) and the highest recalls in the history of the automobile (Toyota) are having an impact.

Having steering failure, as Toyota does, is hardly a good recommendation for a safe car. Cars you can't steer have a tendency to run into things you don't want to run into.

11th Nov 2011, 23:18

Why would domestic owners care about how Toyota owners continue to buy them? I know it doesn't bother me, neither do the so called dominant ratings.

12th Nov 2011, 05:42

12:18 It's specific if someone has serious issues with Toyota. It's no different than my not buying a certain brand of television that failed, if I had better luck with Panasonic than with Sony. So that's specific. What gets me most of all is that a car that has serious safety issues; the fanatics overlook that. They base it on turning the key, and if it runs, that's a great choice. If a car is cheaply built, full of plastic, handles poorly, and rattles, oh well. It got me A to B.