23rd Nov 2011, 21:37
Sadly, even after nearly 23 million recalls and drastic declines in sales, some Toyota fans still chant "Don't bother me with facts, my mind is made up!!" I say "some", because huge numbers of them are trading their dangerous and poorly built Camrys and Corollas for Fusions, Focuses, Malibus and Cruzes. GM still continues to outsell Toyotas 2 to 1 in the U.S.
Times have changed, so has Toyota... for the worse.
24th Nov 2011, 14:04
You have stated numerous times in the past that you never had a domestic make it to 100k without major problems, OK it's definitely possible. Now, my question is, what are the imports that you rave about that did make it to 100k without problems? It can't be your current Toyota at 15k or your 08 Accord that you had for less than 2 years. Looks to me that your Subaru and Saab were also traded in before 100k, and I doubt it was your Nissan, because you had bad experiences with that vehicle...
25th Nov 2011, 03:52
This entire argument is a waste of time - probably being waged by six individuals with nothing better to do. Drive what you want - but stop putting down everyone else's ride. I used to love this site, but it is becoming useless now that the opinionated people have taken over.
25th Nov 2011, 12:29
It's hard to evaluate a 2012 purchase from someone that had vehicles 8 to 10 years ago. I actually prefer new Fords as my first choice. # 2 GM. I had a new Trailblazer SS that had zero issues. I go from brand to brand; whatever has the least issues. I don't buy based on price, it's quality. No one buys our cars but us. I have zero brand loyalty. Every few years I have to be very impressed.
25th Nov 2011, 23:21
Citing facts is hardly "opinionated". When I first found this site, I was on the verge of buying a car (an import) that I discovered had many very unhappy owners. As a result, I take the facts cited here very seriously. I passed up the import and bought a Ford. It has been perfect in every way.
When information (not opinion, but information) is presented, it can be a great source of help to those looking for a car. Some posters on this site tend to bash all domestic vehicles based on bad experiences with one bad domestic bought used and abused with hundreds of thousands of miles on it.
When looking at new cars, there is ample evidence to refute the "import is better" argument. In the past couple of weeks I have read reports from qualified automotive experts, clearly stating that the new Honda CRV is dated and lacking in sophistication. Just today a national publication carried the news that J.D. Powers just ranked Chrysler tops in GPS technology, and Toyota the worst. This is not "opinion". It is fact, and it can help a buyer avoid a major disappointment in an expensive purchase. Too many people rely on ad hype or 20-year-old anecdotal stories, rather than current facts when buying a car. Thankfully the facts posted on this site helped me avoid one of those very costly mistakes. I am very thankful for that.
26th Nov 2011, 15:59
Well, the question wasn't directed towards me, but I can easily answer this one. So the question is what "Import" (Import I am assuming means anything Japanese, since I never see these anti-import comments on any of the other "Import" brands). So here's our list for our family.
1: '85 Camry: 223,000 miles
2: '87 Toyota pickup, 2WD, 4 cylinder: 170,000 miles
3: '88 Toyota 4Runner, V6, 5 speed manual: 260,000 miles
4: '92 Toyota Camry: 230,000 miles
5: '98 Toyota Avalon V6: (Still own) 304,000 miles
6: '96 Toyota Tacoma 2Wd 4 cylinder (still own): 153,000 miles
7: '91 Honda Civic: 170,000 miles
8: '02 Toyota Prius (Still own): 151,000 miles
9: '02 Toyota Tundra (Still own): 264,000 miles
10: '08 Honda CR-V (Still own): 98,000 miles.
ALL of the vehicles above made it well past 150,000 miles without any problems, and even then, the few that did, had very minor issues - like needing a new starter motor or a new wheel bearing. Small stuff. All that we no longer own were sold in perfectly running condition.
So when I hear people rantin' and ravin' about "foreign" cars and supposedly how baaadddd they are, well all I can do is look up at the experience we've had - along with everyone else I know who owns these cars - and consider negative opinions to be bunk, since even as of now Toyota and Honda are still the top-rated, most reliable automakers sold in the US. As long as that is still true, and people like me continue to have flawless ownership experiences with these cars and trucks, we will continue to buy them.
Sure - the Big 3 are doing better, and also build some good cars - many being a LOT better than the crap they used to make. But I still fail to understand why I should switch.
27th Nov 2011, 08:05
...And domestic people trying to defend their choices, continue to NOT read the posts on here.
My GM products were BRAND NEW when purchased, and were driven 80% or more on the highway, and maintained properly and very well. Even the engines were clean and new looking for the entire time I owned them, because I make sure everything I own stays as new as possible for the entire time I own it.
My experiences are fact based, and after all the research I did on my problems, I was far from an isolated case in any of my repair problems.
I can recall countless family issues with GM products as well. My cousin getting stranded because the tranny in his Tahoe failed completely. He was told it was a manufacturing defect that was very common in them.
My uncle who had an Envoy that had the same things go wrong as our TB had, and he traded it at around 36K miles because it was out of warranty.
My Dad who had a Blazer that completely fell apart in the front end.
I mean the list goes on and on, and all of these vehicles were brand new when they came into my family. My uncle and cousin now drive BMW's, and my Dad switched to Jeep, which is still problematic, but not as bad as his Chevy was.
I have heard it all from others on this site, about old, abused, used cars or dishonest dealer networks that just rip me off for large repair bills. Please! In all of my experience with cars, imports are never any trouble for me, all the way to 100K miles and beyond. And yes, I have had older Toyota's and Honda's for over 100K miles. None of them ever gave me any issues, other than normal maintenance. Seriously, even if it was all about dishonest dealers, then I would stick to imports because I never seem to get "ripped off" by an import dealer. Of course the cars and SUV's never need anything to be ripped off for!
I am sure there are many with the same domestic experience, but this is my factual experience, and there is no argument that will change that fact. Until an import really fails me, I won't ever stop owning them.
I do have a Ford as well these days, and it is a pretty solid vehicle. I would definitely buy a Mustang as well or a Fusion. GM, however, will never see one dollar more from me for anything new. The newest car I'd buy from them is a '79 Trans Am. At least that one would be fun to maintain and repair as necessary. I wouldn't be fighting to get to work in it though!
I do love GM muscle from days gone by. It is sad that they just don't make anything that great anymore. It has become more the American way though to cheapen things up and charge more for them, so it isn't out of the norm of American industry.
Now can we please end this argument once and for all? It is getting old again here folks!