22nd Aug 2010, 12:38
Okay, can we please stop comparing Vettes to common every day GM vehicles here? Why do you continue to go on about a basically hand built car from a special separate factory. It's like saying a Viper is the same as a Neon. NO KIDDING the Vette is a high quality performance car. We get it. Let's talk apples to apples okay?
23rd Aug 2010, 09:10
What are you talking about? GM still has 0% for 72 months going on their trucks, 0% financing deals on most cars and a $4,000 rebate on Impala and HHR available right now on their site. Ford has 0% + $1,000 on their site as well.
These are all ending soon, but they have been "ending soon" for over a year now and they always pick up a new set of offers after the old ones expire. If they do actually expire, you will see a shift in top sales performers I guarantee it.
We just looked at a Ford Escape and Toyota RAV 4. The Escape had $4,000 of incentives and such, the RAV 4 had none except a 2.9% finance deal. We bought the Toyota because it was the better vehicle. Had it just been about cost, we'd have surely bought the Ford, which many have done in this economy. Would the Ford have been okay? Sure it would have been, but we just felt the Toyota was better for us.
When it gets back to car vs. car instead of deal vs. deal, AND domestics still hold the top sales positions, you can talk. Let's wait until that happens though, before quoting how good American cars are due to their high sales. Of course, the ongoing incentive train isn't going to stop anytime soon, as the economy is still in the toilet, and they need to fuel sales any way they can. They may drop incentives for a short time, but when sales wane, which they surely will, the incentives will fire up again before the holidays.
23rd Aug 2010, 16:25
Just read an interesting article released by Car and Driver about the ten best list for the last 10 years. The most frequent cars were ALL imports except two... Chevy Corvette and Ford Focus. All the rest were imports... Honda was on the list the for the most awards THREE times. Funny how the experts see things in the auto industry differently then the rest of us, huh? Guess it pays to actually drive all of them in thorough tests, including long term reliability tests, like they do.
23rd Aug 2010, 19:40
"We bought the Toyota because it was the better vehicle."
Not according to every automotive source on Earth. Ford ranks 5th out of 33 car makers. Toyota ranks a rather pathetic TWENTY-FIRST!! Even Honda is ranked below Ford in build quality.
A good friend of mine asked my recommendation on a small SUV, because he was so disappointed with his very poorly built and unreliable Honda CRV. When I pointed out the hundreds of issues Toyota is having and the 10 MILLION recalled vehicles (so far), he opted for the top-rated Escape. He loves it, and at least it will have decent resale value. Toyota's resale has dropped like a brick, and continues to drop.
23rd Aug 2010, 21:50
The best way to buy is to pay cash. I will buy every 100000 miles as soon as the warranty is up. The money I save on import repairs plus working I do no liens. Dealers actually dislike new cash buyers, but that's their problem not mine. You can walk in make a deal or not by simply walking out. I like internet sales, and go to the new car dealer that way with my checkbook.
24th Aug 2010, 10:29
I simply don't get the argument that "I have much less problems with domestics versus imports". What does that mean? An "import" could mean anything from a Yugo, Daewoo, Nissan, Rolls Royce, Aston Martin, Buggati, Cintroen, Honda, Toyota, VW, BMW, Mercedes, or any of the other dozens of "import" brands. The same with "Domestics". Are we talking Ford, GM, Chrysler, Tesla, or any of the other US branded cars?
See, when I see a statement like that all it says to me is that the person making the argument is merely biased in a very simplistic manner. Such arguments have little to do with the actual brand or model, and everything to do with bias against a company only because it happens to be a foreign nameplate. All companies these days have headquarters, design and engineering departments, sales, and testing facilities setup globally. That new Buick Lacrosse you might buy is engineered in Germany with an outer design from Detroit and an interior design from Shanghai. That Chevy Aveo you might buy is actually made in Korean by Daewoo. That Camry you might also purchase was co-engineered and developed in Japan and the US, has an AC system from Delphi - a Michigan based company, and is manufactured in Kentucky.
I could go on and on, but to say the least, auto manufacturing is a truly global enterprise. The cars companies produce are manufactured in a variety of locations globally. Likewise the consistency between models can be drastic, just as much as it can be between companies. For example, Ford and GM have indeed made large gains in quality. But Chrysler on the other hand is lagging behind. Thus a generic statement that ALL "Domestic" brands are better than ALL "Import" brands is an inaccurate statement to begin with.
I've owned a lot of Toyotas, but my family also has owned both Ford and GM products. By and large, the worst products overall were the GM cars and trucks we owned in the 80's. The best have been the Toyota products we have owned off and on from the 80s-today. Thus I have a bias in regards to a specific brand due to my experience. That has been the case with many people and the reason behind Toyota's reputation. They were a totally new brand that was unfamiliar to most Americans in the 70's. Had they truly made bad products, they wouldn't have gotten as far as they have.
But at the end of the day, I would never make such a blanket statement that anything "foreign" is better than anything "domestic".
24th Aug 2010, 14:03
Import or domestic? The location of the parent company where the profits go is the answer. For example a BMW. Assembled in America is a German company. Likewise a Honda or Toyota are Japan owned and main corporate approves design specs parts and where final assembly will be. Where the corporate is defines the brand. GM Ford can have plants overseas, and are domestics here and imports there.
24th Aug 2010, 16:00
Very well said. My statements of import superiority are from many different brands like Toyota, Honda, Subaru and Saab. I have always had better luck with those brands. GM has been the worst of any brand, hands down and is absolutely horrific when it comes to quality. Ford has been good, but not quite as good as any of the import brands I listed. I agree that most cars are part of a global structure. I usually try to cite specific brands when quoting what is better or worse. I don't care so much where they were built as long as they run good.