18th Dec 2007, 15:54
"I really do not get why there's such a massive argument that pops up anytime that a discussion about a Toyota or Honda product on any number of automotive review web sites."
The reason for that is because those of us that have been satisfied with our domestic cars for decades finally got tired of people endlessly bashing domestics and crowing about how great their fart-can boxy Hondas are, and how much "domestics suck." If they insist on visiting Ford Fusion sites, for example, and interjecting their unfounded opinions about how any car other than Japanese is junk and American companies all deserve to go out of business, then it takes on the trappings of a propaganda war. Not that we would care to politicize it, but those of us who own our good domestics simply get sick of hearing the constant drumbeat of misinformation. We are simply compelled to set the record straight in the face of this anti-domestic slander.
19th Dec 2007, 17:10
Read the first comment again... why own one? We sat in amazement ourselves as the first import that was a nightmare and then it happened again. Now we like domestics. The commenters do not pay the repair costs the actual owners do.
20th Dec 2007, 09:58
My 1999 Accord is not a fart can box. In fact, the build quality is higher than many Cadillacs of the time.
I used to drive domestic cars. I used to be a GM family getting the newest stuff. I was tired of driving around 20 year old platforms and switched to far superior Hondas. I also have yet to see a friend with a problem with a Honda or Toyota.
I have also noticed that friends and co workers with GM cars do not care when expensive things go wrong. It is like they expected it to fail, and when a check engine light comes on in a Japanese car they go haywire.
20th Dec 2007, 15:57
20th Dec 2007, 01:39.
I know people who are excited with their Cavalier and who are excited with offerings like the new Chrysler Sebring. I know people excited about just about every single one of Chryslers new products. Does that make them good? I know people who have over 200k on death traps. Does that make them superior to a car like a Honda that is built better and has a better engine?
Are you telling me that while they were trying to cut costs, General Motors somehow built a better engine than Honda?
In my view, Honda is all about building great engines and GM builds some of the worst, yet you say they rock.
21st Dec 2007, 07:06
I can't wait until these pieces of junk Ford Fusions start falling apart. Those of us old enough remember Ford's same marketing strategies for cars like the Contour, the new Taurus (a 500 renamed because no one wanted it), and the original Taurus. "They'll compete with the Accord and Camry". Yeah, sure they will. Many of them self-destructed between 50,000 and 70,000 miles, while the Honda's and Toyota's just kept rolling along right past 2 and 300,000 miles, like always.
I think I'm going to start calling this car the "Great Ford Hope". They're still new; give them a while.
21st Dec 2007, 09:39
Yeah, well, I'm old enough to remember the 1929 Ford "Model A" and they're still on the road, so what's your point?
21st Dec 2007, 10:20
(9:58) Although we are not friends, I owned a 2002 (Honda) Acura TL. Please go to the absolutely deplorable reviews and see why I have 2007 GM's. I owned Accords, Legends, Integra; all fine, and then forget it when I could afford high end Honda. The Legend was worth it, but the RL replacement is not worth 50k in my opinion. Toyotas are too plain and uninspired to drive anymore based on my opinion.
21st Dec 2007, 14:52
Oh, well then I guess you have a different opinion. Opinion does not equal fact.
21st Dec 2007, 14:53
So why are the Ford Taurus reviews from 2003-2006 so much BETTER than the Camry reviews for the same time period??
22nd Dec 2007, 09:49
Why doesn't Japan build all their cars strictly in Japan with their own labor force? How can you commend an import vehicle you drive built by American workers?
Personally I agree my Hondas and Toyotas were made better in Japan years ago, but not since... I remember in Consumer Reports having imports with every category with dark circles indicating excellent and they were fine. I never had to go back to a dealer... but I sure did recently. It will take a lot to get me back.
I like domestic V8's better made and I am out having fun instead of lanquishing in import customer service areas.
My Acura dealer gave us free Snapple to drink while you wait and a car wash; other than that, bring your wallet/credit cards, I know I had to. I liked Honda a lot; it wasn't that we tried and tried and kept buying new ones, but it became unpleasant owning them.
22nd Dec 2007, 20:12
14:52 Fact is when a person that actually owns the vehicle indicates its specific longevity. Generalizing all vehicles is not taking into account someone who stretches their oil changes, forgets filters, doesn't warm them up (which destroys any car), and yet someone else that does everything by the book, and then still has import sludging due to engine design, defective transmissions, faulty air bags, brakes that prematurely fail and then buys domestics.
Maybe for that specific individual their opinion that they are sick of paying for repairs has merit based on experience vs. rationalizing it was just one bad experience or another lemon.
23rd Dec 2007, 13:02
So your opinion is fact? You think engines like the eco tec and many of the other engines out of GM are the worlds best? Why is Honda the #1 engine builder? How can an engine in a Civic run more smooth than a V6 in an American car? Why must I buy a 4.0 V6 with less horsepower than a 3.0 in a Honda? Hmmm. Maybe the Chrysler K-car has the best engine in the world?
24th Dec 2007, 23:06
Considering that my '90 Dodge Omni with the 2.2 litre non-turbo 4 made 240,000+ miles with ZERO engine repairs except for 2 timing belts, still didn't use a drop of oil, and would bark the tires hitting 3rd gear, I'd say "YES", some Chrysler engines DO qualify as some of the world's best.
As for Honda, our Civic's CV joints were clattering at 40,000 miles, the car was using a quart of oil every three weeks (or less if we actually WENT anywhere) after 50,000 miles, and the brake pads had to be replaced at just over 40,000 miles (the Omni had exactly TWO brake jobs in 240,000 miles). Now what were you saying about how superior Honda is?? How about some real EVIDENCE, not just an "opinion". As for the Camry, as it has been said OVER AND OVER, READ THE REVIEWS: They're AWFUL!!
25th Dec 2007, 06:30
My retired neighbors who drove everywhere had a pair of Omnis hatchbacks that were indestructible. I don't like the styling and too small, but I have to admire them. They were never broken down and they went away a lot on trips.
I have driven many company cars over 16 years, averaging 50,000 miles a year/3 states, and the best ever have been Crown Vics. That's a lot of annual driving behind the wheel. Time is money, and the only stop was quick lube centers every month, in and out in less than 10 minutes, and sometimes longer for replacement tires and brakes. Other than that, I hate shops and not have to rent, although some such as Enterprise will pick them up.
I personally love American V8 engines; they cruise at very low rpm with little effort and are very durable for hard stop/go and long distance hard daily driving. I have never had any engine or transmissions that have ever needed to be replaced, easily surpassing 100,000 miles and still running like new for starting over to the next new vehicle again.