Comments: 1-15, 16-30, 31-45, 46-60, 61-75, 76-90, 91-105, 106-120, 121-135, 136-144
I just wanted to put my two cents in. I drive a 2006 tacoma Double cab Prerunner V6. First it dosent tow 8000 lbs. like someone posted that's crazy. The Tundra barely tows that much. It tows 6500 lbs. at that's if your vehicle isn't loaded down GWVR. That's fine with me cause I don't need it for towing anything heavier than that. The resale value of the Tacoma is the highest in the midsize class which is 48% after five years. Sure domestic compact/midsize cost less and resale value is a lot lower, but I've done my math thru and thru and it all balances out. A lot of people say for the price of a Tacoma you can get a fullsize domestic, and I would have to agree with that, but for those that paid full sticker price for a Tacoma then that's just stupidity. I paid 3800 dollars below MSRP, and for what I paid I could of got a Full size domestic with a lot fewer options and not double, but extended, it just didn't fit my needs. As far as quality goes I would say Toyota has got the upper hand right now. People have to consider that there are still a lot more GM and Ford and Dodge trucks on the road than Toyotas. So to say I see more people take in Domestics to the shop vs. Toyotas is being ignorant to that fact. I would say since the Domestic brands are hurting the last couple years with huge deficits that corner cutting has been done, sacrificing quality for profit. Toyota is turning profit right now and is enjoying the quality image that most people label them. We will see how well the quality remains once they reach that top spot from GM. If it remains sure Ill stay in a Toyota for all my reasons and needs. If I'm want to move up in size I might look at the new 07 Tundra coming out as it will finally be competitive with Domestics. The tacoma does ride a bit rougher than my buddies full size Chevy. I would say cause its not as wide, can't really say and haven't really compared to the smaller domestics. Maybe its not an issue with me cause I spent two years driving military Humvees in the deserts of Iraq, so anything feels plush to me lately. That's my two cents.
These comments are VERY entertaining (my friends and I still crack up over the "I saw FORDS at a FORD dealership" comment).
Since American cars are SOOOOO unreliable and fall apart so quickly, I thought I'd better do a "cost check" on the new vehicles I've owned since 1985 and see just how horrendous my repair bills have been. I'm listing EVERY REPAIR except for tires, batteries and oil changes. I AM listing brake repairs, but since I know how to drive I never have to replace brake pads before 100,000 miles on ANYTHING I've owned except the 1st one listed. The cars and expenses are as follows:
1985 Mustang, sold at 110,000 miles. Total repairs: $385
1988 Daytona, sold at 90,000 miles. Total repairs: $80
1993 Ranger, sold at 62,000 miles. Total repairs $ 0
2001 Dakota, totalled at 51,000 miles. Total repairs $ 0
2001 Pontiac Grand Am (still own) 60,000 miles. Total rep.: $0
2003 GMC (still own) 50,000 miles. Total repairs: $0
As you can see in 21 years and 6 vehicles I've spent a TOTAL on repairs of $465. Now, factoring in how much MORE I would have had to pay for a comparable Toyota instead of the cars listed, I would have spent a total of $41,000 MORE. To me it looks like I have come out about $40,535 BETTER OFF by driving those "crappy, unreliable" American vehicles. Of course if the Toyota experts use the same (non) logic in their math that they use in all their other comments, I'm sure they can figure SOME WAY to dismiss these figures and show that I REALLY LOST 5 million dollars.
When trucks are scored by Consumer Reviews they factor in every element. The list includes Comfort, Performance, Handling, Exterior styling, Interior Design, Features, Value, Reliability. Total all the elements the score was 3.8 Ranger...3.8 Tacoma a tie! AlsoI cannot imagine the American made cars and trucks I would have missed out on. There has been a lot of reliable and my opinion dull vehicles that just do not have any thrill factor. If you want to be in an accountant mode price/resale and factor out the majority of the key elements of driving fine. I see in 5 years a Toyota losing over half of what you spent. If I lose 10 even 15% more even so what? I have not been impressed enough to change from a car/truck enthusiast to a bean counter. The greatest enjoyment I can indicate is spending time with my son since he was 14 building vehicles. We are a white collar household, but instead of isolating from each other we spent evenings weekends at home in the garage. I believe that has been one of the most rewarding benefits in his growth. We built his VW bug, a 73 Mercedes 450 SL and he has since built late model Mustangs that have been in shows. I buy whatever is the most fun to drive and currently is a domestic. By the way if I owned a new Z06 Corvette I wouldn't ever be using my computer at all
anymore I would be out having a blast......
You SHOULDN'T have any repairs with vehicles that have only 50 or 60 thousand miles on them. Look at the Mustang, first one to get over 100,000 miles without completely falling apart, and you have several hundred dollars in repairs, and it would have continued to get geometrically worse. The smartest thing you could have done was exactly what you did: unload those pieces of crap before they actually had to attempt to get down the road with any kind of high mileage on them. Thanks for helping me prove my point. You Big 3 owners think that a Toyota driver is going to be impressed by a car that probably got pampered for 60,000 miles and hasn't needed repairs? Let me know how it's doing when it has another 140,000 on it. Of course, it will probably have been melted down into soup cans by then.
Just when I finally get over laughing at the "I saw Fords at a Ford dealership" comment I run across one just as funny (maybe more so) on the Corolla site. A commenter says the engine blew up in his Corolla at 34,000 miles (not really that uncommon, it happened to one of our neighbors) but that he WOULD BUY ANOTHER ONE!!! Then he adds, "but only from a TOYOTA DEALERSHIP"!! (Gee, as to opposed to what? Having the car fairy leave it under his pillow?? It really amazes me how powerful the Japanese car myth is. A Toyota owner has an engine blow up at 34,000 miles and he'll BUY ANOTHER ONE, then if the tail light bulb burns out on a Ford or GM at 300,000 miles, it is labeled "crappy American garbage". I bet psychologists have a bellyfull of laughs reading these comments.
I have yet to hear read one domestic owner have the total lack of refinement in their descriptions as you definitely possess. They are just factual and trying to be helpful. You definitely have a real chip on your shoulder. There are many individuals that you are alienating on here. Its possible that someone might be borderline acquiring a Toyota vs. a domestic. You lack of benefit of the doubt may come to haunt you one day if it hasn't already. Perhaps if you toned it down completely you would have less arrows directed at you. Your comments are a complete put down. If your mother or a relative heaven forbid drives a domestic do you talk down to them with a complete lack of respect? Sad. Drive your old truck around its yours... we are doing fine and will continue.
We put 230,000+ miles on our Dodge with less than $500 in total repairs. That is NO WAY "increasing exponentially" after 60,000 miles. When we sold the Dodge it still did not use oil, had NEVER had the CV joints replaced, the A/C still blew cold, and the only engine repair EVER had been two timing belts replaced (routine maintenance). My sister-in-law drove her Ford for 16 years and put 300,000+ miles on it with less than $400 in total repairs. It, too, was traded in reasonably good running condition (for another Ford naturally). American cars generally cost far LESS to maintain after 150,000-200,000 miles than a Toyota because the parts are far less expensive and labor costs are less because they are easier to work on. The commenter making such unfounded statements has obviously never owned an American vehicle.
First off, the point I was making about Fords at the Ford service garage was that they were NEW Fords being worked on because they were having problems from the get go. The word "new" was the operative word there, not Ford.
Toyota has far fewer recalls, builds much longer lasting, higher quality vehicles than anybody else. You don't even have to drive a Toyota to know that it is better than Big 3 garbage. Just look at it. Look under the hood; how much more thought out the design and placement of the components are.
ONCE AGAIN, I'll say that this is my third Toyota, and I know for a fact that nothing else could have withstood the beatings that the first two took. I don't care how many of you think that your Fords and Chevy's perform as well as my Toyota, because you are wrong and none of them do.
I don't think that it is very admirable of people who drive Fords and Chevy's to claim that they are as reliable as Toyota's and Honda's. The thing that you are missing is that even if you get lucky and your Chevy runs OK for a while, you're still missing out on the enjoyment of driving something that is well put together. It's a different experience, a better one. I don't care if you drive a Corvette, it's still a sloppy, poorly assembled car. Toyota's and Honda's specifically make the best cars on the road.
Toyotas get greater resale because their price tag is inflated by a mostly perceived value. This begain in the 70s and 80s. Now they're still overpriced and they generally last longer because the population demographic that buys them are generally folks as tame and as bland as the Toyotas they buy. As a result, they follow all the rules and maintain their vehicles by the Toyota Certified demigods (tm), causing those vehicles to last longer.
Also, if you paid such an exorbitant amount for what's really just an appliance, wouldn't you make sure it's maintained well? I would. Obviously that contributes to the survival rate numbers for Toyota vehicles. For various (real) reasons, aside from the quality bogeyman that all the Toyota fanboys love to mention, American cars get discounted ad nauseum, contributing to a misguided notion that they are worth less (not worthless) and must not be good vehicles. This mentality often leads clueless owners to fail the proper maintenance of their American vehicle.
I have owned Toyotas and Acuras in the past and I can safely say that they are nothing at all the write home about. I meticulously maintained both of them and I still had more than my share of trouble. The Acura Integra was a culprit of harboring gremlins in the electrical system, draining my batteries as well as requiring the replacement of my whole starting system. This is without mentioning that the car just hated being in third or fifth gear.
The Toyota, I can say, was simply guilty of being boring as hell. Though at one point, the O2 sensors fried for no particular reason, which was a bit irritating. I would add, though, that the 2000 Corolla I owned was very cheap in build quality and it showed throughout. Reliable? Mostly. Worth the money? No, not at all - and it's my fault for buying it. The 1987 Buick I owned before these two cars, also meticulously maintained, was a far better, enjoyable car and, dollar for dollar, a better deal overall. One could argue that maybe if I had a second American car, I'd have had more chances for disappointment. Maybe. Maybe not. For all the disgusting waxing poetic of Toyota fans, though, I don't see how it's justified.
The value and costs of a car are based on perception. Toyota has an awesome marketing machine that systematically fools people into believing their bland vehicles are worth the extra, inevitable several thousand dollars. Good for them. But that doesn't make their cars better, necessarily. I also know that there's no way to convince a rabid Toyota buyer that this is true and that most of that glory is immaterial and in their head. Of course, if I were unable to admit that I made an unwise purchase, I would do everything in my power to justify it by crowing about how wonderful it is and that it's working on the cure for cancer while parked in my garage. Honest.
How do I know? I used to do that in order to justify the $2,000 extra fleecing I endured just to own a grotesquely dull and rather shoddy Toyota Corolla.
In anticipation of all the comments this comment is sure to draw from Toyota lovers hastily searching for my address so they can run me down, Toyota emblem first, I would like to finally add one thing:
Total lack of refinement is driving a Ford or Chevy and believing that it is better than a Toyota in any way. We're not talking about '69 Chevelles here either. Yeah, they once made good cars. They don't now. If were discussing any GM or Ford made in the last 25 or so years, then it is a pitiful shame when compared to any Toyota. By the way, GM and Ford's quality is actually getting worse instead of better. The Cavalier's were better cars than the Cobalt is, even though the Cobalt may be prettier, and by the way, it looks like a cheap copy of a Nissan. I don't talk down to anyone who drives a domestic vehicle until they try to tell me that it is better than a Toyota or Honda. That shows me that they do not know what they are talking about, and do not deserve the benefit of an intelligent discussion.
My parents drive a Lincoln Navigator. They are far from unrefined. Hopefully we have learned a lot from the hard work and education they passed on to us. I prefer domestics myself.
If someone disagrees with owning a Toyota they are not worthy of an intelligent conversation. I do not know what your background or intelligence level is. With all due respect I am not going to base my buying decision on an individual cruising solo in a Tacoma. I cannot see how you can make random comments on an entire automotive industry. It doesn't follow. There are business owners that purchase fleets of pick ups, company cars etc. on here that read these reviews. I would rather read their experiences. That would benefit my situation more than this. I prefer domestics.
Where is the refined ride? I drive 3000 miles a month. I own a 2005 Silverado V6 and already have over 70,000 miles with minimal routine maintenance. The V6 runs smooth and gets good mpg. I most of all do not want a harsh bouncy ride. My Silverado is comfortable and I love it! Too much hype. Drive what I do a month as far as the mileage and report back.
In response to comment 16:18: THANK YOU!! It is very refreshing to read comments from honest and intelligent car owners such as you. My family has also owned a Toyota (a Celica GT) and found it to be no more reliable or inexpensive to drive than our 1977 Buick LeSabre (which went 230,000 miles without a problem). As a therapist I'm very familiar with how people's thought processes work, and all your comments regarding how people perceive value are right on. I could drive a Mercedes if I wanted to impress people, but I prefer spending my money more sensibly and choose American made cars because they are far and away the best in value. My cars are meticulously maintained and never have problems. My total repair costs on my family's Ford, GM and Chrysler cars and SUV's since 1989 has been exactly ZERO. I don't see how you can do any better than that, plus they offer style, comfort and performance that is lacking in the imports. Thank you for your very intelligent and factual comment. I wish others on this site were as thoughtful and honest.
My first car was a 89 corolla. Got it real cheap because at a little over 60k the head blew. Fixed it up with my dad, and aside from being frugal on gas it was slow, boring to drive and scary on the freeway when larger cars passed you by.
It didn't last me long, and it wasn't Toyota's fault either, because it got totaled by an old Ford F-150, that only received a small dent in the bumper.
Morale of the story? Reliability is overrated. You should always consider Safety first, then running costs.
I still wish one the manufacturers would make a 4 cylinder diesel midsize truck.
BTW: I visited the GM Pontiac plant, where they make the Full size pickups for Chevy & GMC and I was amazed.