12th Oct 2012, 16:02

Wow. People have short memories. It was just three years ago that Toyota was forced, after THREE Grand Jury subpoenas, to recall 23 million cars for life-threatening defects that had already resulted in a number of deaths. They now have the dubious distinction of having recalled more cars in three years than all three of the Big Three have recalled in their entire history combined. And people still defend these poorly built death traps. Go figure.

12th Oct 2012, 21:21

That's great that 2 vehicles run OK. We have heard about the 90s Tacoma and Tundra over and over. Since that era, many late model buyers have had issues with engines, transmissions, air bags, braking etc.

13th Oct 2012, 06:49

Why don't give the Toyota bashing a break and you address the past recalls of your beloved Ford Motor Company? Seems to me they have had more than a few over the years.

13th Oct 2012, 07:39

Well allow me to remind you of some Ford recalls -

1970-1980 - 21 million recalled - transmissions that failed to engage park.

1992-2003 - 15 million recalled - cruise control deactivation fires.

1988-1993 - 7.9 million recalled - ignition switch fires.

Hmmm... I guess people who live in glass houses really shouldn't throw stones...

13th Oct 2012, 12:59

Well, the nice thing about this is that there's not even a real argument to see here. Latest reliability surveys still show Toyota, along with Honda and Nissan, at the top of the list. End of debate.

13th Oct 2012, 20:23

There was an article in my newspaper regarding the massive Toyora recall. A Toyota company official was quoted as saying that after 2000, Toyota got careless and sloppy in building cars. It's funny that Toyota itself admits freely that their quality plummeted after 2000, but Toyota fans apparently won't even listen to Toyota!!

13th Oct 2012, 22:17

You mean that nonsense about carpets getting in the way of accelerator pedals? Even if it's an actual mechanical problem and not the mats, people should learn how to drive and how to react to a car that has "sudden acceleration." You know, like putting the thing into neutral.

And you really expect me to believe that these recalls weren't politically motivated, especially considering this was at the time of the bailouts of GM and Chrysler?

14th Oct 2012, 08:17

I own 4 GMs; no issues on my new ones.

I'm curious if you wish to specifically address all the Toyota recalls in the past few years? I had a seat belt retractor recall on my 2006 GM. That's it. Not all the sludging, air bags, brakes etc.

I can't see how you can recommend this make. Maybe the 1995 Tacoma and 2000 Tundra were OK. Even the latter is old. The past few years seem a downward spiral. Should be high quality and no issues whatsoever for a 2013 buyer. But can you recommend one?

I agree with the Ford commenters. I know I would buy a Ford F Series with as much enthusiasm as a Silverado. As far as 2013 models go, they are great.

14th Oct 2012, 15:15

I find it interesting that in its small SUV comparison (which the Ford Escape won), Motor Trend didn't even bother to test the noisy and unreliable Toyota RAV 4. To say Toyota quality has not gone down is ridiculous. Even Toyota says that.

14th Oct 2012, 20:04

Yes, the carpet getting in the way of the accelerator pedals is indeed nonsense. This was the first excuse Toyota came up with on the first recall, then they realized it was a mechanical problem, and along came the second recall for the same problem.

Also, I love your remedy to throw the car in neutral if the accelerator sticks, like it's no big deal that there is potential to kill somebody.

15th Oct 2012, 11:19

Good point, now they are recalling the window switch problem for the second time!

15th Oct 2012, 12:31

And again, I always find it interesting that those who clearly don't like Toyota somehow know MORE about them than their own beloved domestic cars. They in fact know so much, that they have become real experts. Even though they have never owned a Toyota, they are very quick to point out a few "facts" they claim are true - such as this non-ending claim that somehow, as if by magic, that since (a random fate in time) that Toyota quality has fallen.

These and other claims of course have no real foundation to sit on, and the latest quality reports shows that this isn't true either.

So please - those of you who have never owned, or will never own a Toyota, go right ahead and tell the rest of us what other interesting things you know about this brand... We're listening...

15th Oct 2012, 22:52

More people were killed because of the "nonsense" of Toyota's unintended acceleration than died in all the Pintos that caught fire.

16th Oct 2012, 07:48

Your domestic comments are 10 years old. I guess Toyota picked up the slack since then. Especially the past 3 years on the massive recalls. Recent top publications are indicating these facts. End of story. Done.

16th Oct 2012, 09:26

I have, and learned a lot in the dealer service department, which prompted the change. I suspect with new high vehicle and related maintenance expenses and issues, people become savvy. Not all at once, as it usually takes time to change. Resources are everywhere, including this fine site. I wish I knew of it earlier, as it would have saved some pain. We are driving Ford models. Not decade old Toyotas.

16th Oct 2012, 12:23

What is it meant that "People became savvy?" Toyota still makes the best-selling car in America, so I guess it means more people buy Toyotas... right?

16th Oct 2012, 16:10

I don't have to own a Toyota, I work on them all the time, problems that were unheard of years back.

That there is all I need to know.

17th Oct 2012, 01:31

I don't know Motor Trend's rule, but with Car and Driver, they won't put a vehicle that has lost a comparison test in with new vehicles. I'll assume the same applies at Motor Trend. So, for example, the Escape is a newly redesigned model, but the RAV4 isn't, and it probably did not win the previous comparison, therefore it wasn't included. I remember Car and Driver made an exception one time to bring back a car that had gotten second place, but I think even then, it was a different trim level.

Car magazines, incidentally, are the last place one should be looking for real "information" on car ownership. They are all about the drive. We have them to "thank" for cars all having pretty good handling now at the expense of nice rides, as though handling really matters to 99% of drivers.

17th Oct 2012, 07:55

Well since this is a full size truck review, the best selling vehicle in America has been Ford's full size truck. That also means cars as well. For decades by the way.

I believe the savvy comment was that people eventually wise up with major repairs. Last years result is no guarantee that it will remain an upward trend. Poor reports can just as easily make it a bad buy. Look at stocks as another quick example of an overnight drop in popularity. All these recalls are no asset.

17th Oct 2012, 12:11

I work on cars too, and I have yet to experience this so-called mystery of Toyotas magically having more problems the newer they are. Secondly, the quality reports did not come from car magazines. They came from consumer surveys.