24th Jun 2007, 14:59

6:07 Most of GM's problems are caused by them having to pay huge retirement packages to people who have long since retired from the company. Also they actually PAY THEIR EMPLOYEES WELL, something Toyota doesn't do.

I'll bet you didn't know that Toyota won't allow unions in their manufacturing plants in America did you? I too have heard horror stories about how Toyota treats their American workers. And you say these people know that the vehicles they make are supposedly inferior, but they haven't actually said that to you. So there you go again, assuming things that aren't even true.

All you've really said so far is 'GM makes nothing, but crap, everybody knows that' but you haven't actually backed up anything.

24th Jun 2007, 20:03

So what! I have family who is in spots that run higher offices are GM. They know that the Japanese have a great product, but they cannot build something that is close because they have bean counters who save money using different parts that are cheaper. now you have heard from a creditable source the reason why the Detroit cars are inferior--the bean counters and technology that is past its prime.

25th Jun 2007, 07:14

A credible source? An anonymous posting about someone who knows someone else within GM management. All companies look at costs for when they build vehicles. What Toyota and Honda don't have are legacy costs from generations of retired workers. So when did magnetic shocks, 6 speed automatic transmissions, various hybrid drive-trains, and carbon fibre and magnesium super cars become out dated?

25th Jun 2007, 09:22

North American manufacturers have not learned. They continue to produce cars that will break down after 3-4 years. Japanese cars are good after 10 years with few things to fix. I can't figure out why and how, but that's the fact. Until North American manufacturer produces comparable quality, they will fall on the wayside, and will be a small player in the world in the coming years.

25th Jun 2007, 18:11

My only wish is that the Soltice/Skye at some point would become available with a normally aspirated V8 engine. There is absolutely no current Toyota sports car or any kind of convertible vehicle that we could even consider. Just being herded into high fuel economy potato shaped vehicles couldn't be more boring. I would at least find a used Supra and do a ground up restoration. If the new Toyota concept sports car becomes available I will be fair and may return as an import buyer.

25th Jun 2007, 18:16

So you think an Impala is just as refined as an Accord or Camry?

Well first of all, the vehicle comes out of Chevrolet's design studio as a beautiful concept car, the bean counters then take all the nice parts off and put on cheap crap, and then it is built from a parts bin shared with the other vehicles.

Legacy costs? They could not even get it right when those employees still worked at GM and they had not retired.

Get into any GM and feel the interior. The parts will not fit together, and the inside will not be pleasant at all. Look at things like the gauges, materials used etc. you will notice that at any distance that many costs were cut in building those materials.

25th Jun 2007, 20:47

14:49 READ the comment again. I DID say that a couple have admitted it to me. If at this point you can't see or comprehend the mountain of facts that clearly show that Toyota's are way better than any GM, Ford, or Dodge, then you don't deserve to drive a Toyota. The facts have been stated on this site about a million times; and they are facts.

27th Jun 2007, 15:07

So GM took some paint and added a few numbers to the SS gauge cluster? I think it is just as fancy as my old Accord, and that is a dis since it is 13 years old.

12th Jul 2007, 15:36

Reliability starting to fail? Unheard of! I think you just are joining the anti-japanese crowd who take numbers like 133 vehicles recalled and call it the end of Toyota as we know it. At least my Japanese car does not tip over easily or start fires in unexplainable places.

18th Jul 2007, 16:48

Apparently someone has perhaps only ridden in their parents Impala and have become a know it all on all new GM performance vehicles. I can sit in a parked vehicle and admire leather stitching and ergonomic armrests or experience the exilaration in a new Z06 or a Dodge Viper without the needless frills. Sorry cupholders and extra lighters aren't my forte. It amazes me those that have never placed a foot in these vehicles become the authority. It's a shame they will never know what they are missing.

20th Jul 2007, 00:36

Obviously Chevrolet and Dodge can make billions off selling Corvettes and Vipers.

It just repeats and repeats on this site. Someone compares a Camry or Accord to anything on this site and it will win... then the domestic crowd has no choice, but to bring out the Corvette with its Cavalier steering wheel and the Dodge Viper which is known as the best built vehicle in the world because of the renowed K-car. Gotcha. Now I know why the Big two are doing so well.

20th Jul 2007, 11:45

You couldn't give me Corvette. Why? Because General Motors makes them, which automatically qualifies it as being junk. A Camry with three wheels is worth more than a Vette.

20th Jul 2007, 23:45

Anyone who tries to tell you Accords are good cars doesn't have a clue what they are talking about, I know this from experience. Also, in the surveys about 'problems per 100 vehicles', Lincoln has WAY fewer problems than Toyota, and Ford is very close if not exactly the same. Don't believe me? Look it up.

21st Jul 2007, 21:02

Lincoln doesn't sell many cars, so it is hard to find 100 problems per 100 cars. Go a head and buy that Lincoln you were savoring for. Just do not expect to get any money back after 1 year or any reliability back in return. Just a rebadged Ford with leather and an engine.

22nd Jul 2007, 14:26

You mean in the same way that Lexus is just a rebaged Camry with leather and an engine?

22nd Jul 2007, 16:15

The difference is that the Camry is worth rebadging and upgrading. When GM does it, they take a piece of junk, put another name and price to it, yet it's still the same piece of junk.

Myself and my family stopped buying from GM and Ford a long time ago. Those of you who defend them don't have your facts straight, but drive whatever you like. I just feel sorry for someone that would actually buy a Ford or GM car, when Toyota's and Honda's are available. You can even buy a Hyundai for cheaper than the domestics, and it's a better car every time.

I really get a kick out of people who buy GM's because of the warranty. They're admitting that it's a piece of junk, but at least it's covered (if GM is in business long enough to cover it).

22nd Jul 2007, 21:33

Lexus can actually pull off the execution. It seems to be only foreign cars and maybe the newer Cadillacs that can do it right.

23rd Jul 2007, 10:34

1145...What Camry costs $60k have $400 per tire are we comparing to the 2007 Vette? I am not seeing the standard 100,000 mile warranty that instills faith in the only 36,000 mile meager warranties offered? That is why I no longer drive an Acura.