7th Feb 2008, 16:20
22:04 The point is valid; and the point is, the engine in a 20 year old Toyota is a better engine than anything the Big 3 (what a joke) have yet to come up with. A 20 year old 22RE engine in a 1988 Toyota truck is a more efficient, higher quality engine than anything in a brand spanking new Ford, Chevy, Dodge, or anything else for that matter other than Honda. If the Big 3 expect to be taken seriously, they need to take some cues from Toyota and Honda, and for the first time ever put some serious time and effort into designing good engines and drivetrains.
Yes, you might get lucky enough to get a Ford truck to go to 250,000 miles. Doubtful, but let's say it happens. The same size Toyota engine will go 100,000 more than that, getting 10 or 15 miles per gallon better than the Ford the whole time.
It's a matter of design and efficiency. Rev an old Ford up to 4 grand. Do the same with an old Toyota with the same size engine. The Ford will sound like it's ready to blow up at any second and the Toyota will sound like a tightly built, proper engine.
As far as the rest of the truck, Toyota wins hands down. Anybody who has a good amount of offroad experience knows for a fact that a Toyota will hold together when anything else falls apart years sooner under the same treatment.
15th Feb 2008, 16:06
To 22:04:
Show me a 20 year old Toy engine, or even just a modern toy engine, that can match the performance and economy of a LS3 or LS7. GM has many more advanced engines. If you really think that those engines they put in Cadillacs these days couldn't hold a candle to 20 year old Toy engines, then I don't know what to tell you.
GM has invented more than Toy and Honda combined.
GM was making hybrids before Toyota was building the Prius. Not cars, no, but Diesel Hybrid buses.
16th Feb 2008, 12:14
16;06 Yes, GM and Ford were at the cutting edge 70 years ago. Not anymore; not for the last 30 years. Proof of it is that Ford turned to Toyota for help making hybrid cars. And yes, a 20 year old Toyota engine is a more efficient, longer lasting engine for it's size than anything in a Cadillac or any other 'domestic' (which now apparently means made in Mexico) car.
Toyota and Honda are responsible for most of TODAY'S technology in automobiles. The domestics have been trying to play catchup since the early 80's and are failing miserably. Granted, they are taking forward steps, but Toyota takes 3 to their every one.
GM and Ford will never catch up. Too little too late. They should have worried about making quality cars and trucks back when they were the only game in town, and maybe they wouldn't be in such sad shape now.
16th Feb 2008, 16:12
16:20 so your arguments are off road based, and then revving the engine as to why you buy a truck... which you could even buy a 4x4 SUV, a Jeep or a very little 4 wheeler on a trailer to ride in the woods; even a dirt bike.
I bought a new truck for 100% function first... to fully utilize its 8 foot 3/4 ton capacity bed, not a light bouncy 1/2 ton bed... also to tow a large heavy boat up a slick ramp, and drive to and from the shore in heavy traffic with plenty of interior room for a family.
Maybe some families ride in the woods all day and go to dealerships with that pursuit in mind... I see the long bed, hitch, frame strength otherwise I see buying a car to use. And actually I own both.
You need to weigh every component on a truck, not focus entirely on a motor alone, although the new domestic motor and warranty is superior as long as that topic is brought up. Especially the diesels!
17th Feb 2008, 08:08
16;12 Well, most of that is opinion, so I can't argue with it, but you are surely dead wrong on one point: any domestic engine, new or old, is not in the same league as a Toyota engine, new or old. Sorry.. not so. The warranty is longer, that's true. Too bad you'll actually need it with the domestic and you can just drive the Toyota and probably never worry about it.
17th Feb 2008, 14:20
19:12 agreeing with above domestic commenter, however that is the complete opposite of their own import comment. What's that about?
In addition, Toyotas being more American than the big 3 because of a commercial they simply watched on TV? I think the power of advertising and it's influence is clearly evident by this import commenter and the import hype attached. Sorry I do not accept hype.
Get out there behind the wheel and test drive several new import/domestic trucks with a list of expectations that will not be deviated from, and buy on your own, not from hype or from salespeople. Evaluate negative reviews to be informed, but at least get out there and test first hand and evaluate your own driving opinion. It's your money and you owe itself to you to not buy on hype.
I test drove and had a list of expectations. I fully compared first hand new many full size trucks, and now drive a new Silverado.
18th Feb 2008, 08:11
12:14 -- Ford did not get help from Toyota in developing its hybrids, nor did it buy Toyota parts to build them. Ford and Toyota simply cross-licensed some of their hybrid vehicle technology patents. It would be just as fair to say that Toyota uses Ford technology in their hybrids as it is to say that Ford uses Toyota technology.
18th Feb 2008, 14:09
8:11 Wrong. Ford engineers consulted engineers at Toyota about hybrid technology. Toyota would not need to stoop low enough to use any Ford parts or ideas.
18th Feb 2008, 14:14
14:20 Well, as a proud Toyota owner, I don't accept hype either. Like, 'Ford Tough'. I drive them and decide. I've owned them all. The Fords and GM's proved themselves to be junk over and over again. The 3 Toyota's have never needed a dime in repairs. End of story. Telling a story about bad Toyota's and good domestics that you've owned doesn't change things. It's the opposite in reality.
6th Feb 2008, 22:04
17:59 sums it up the hype is unreal. You would turn down a new 3/4 ton domestic pickup truck for free to make payments on an new smaller import.
I have had numerous company vehicles, and rest assured import/domestic I could care less. That's OK as it beats having a mortgage with new paid for vehicles I have had, and just pay taxes on personal use.
I cannot imagine why someone would want a Tundra when they can own a far superior domestic diesel 3/4 ton domestic pickup.
A Tundra cannot tow my boat (low tow ratings) or have the load capacity, room or warranty.
The domestic Tahoe hybrid is 2008 Green Vehicle of the year, matching Camry's city mpg, and the new Silverado hybrid is also a great example of the latest domestic technology advancements.
I can read about 1980 GM models someone once owned or old Toyota 10 year plus models, but what is the point reiterating 10-20 year old archaic technology? If you own a 2007-08 full size truck, you have my attention however.